tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-600589111118264680.post3699046893438283973..comments2024-03-10T21:35:32.778+11:00Comments on 3++ is the new black. | Kirb your enthusiasm!: Marine codex 'review' (#8): dreads.Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07693773850422698445noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-600589111118264680.post-39861291460894423402010-09-24T15:05:21.033+10:002010-09-24T15:05:21.033+10:00This comment has been removed by the author.LegenMythManhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17846920186112525648noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-600589111118264680.post-25326139558037938852010-09-21T15:26:27.550+10:002010-09-21T15:26:27.550+10:00Quite often, actually, especially when there's...Quite often, actually, especially when there's armor saturation. Having played a 6-dread list with 3 ironclads, it happens fairly regularly. Doesn't mean I don't hold my breath every time someone shoots at me, but it's not exactly a forgone conclusion either.tzeentchlinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07886812068265076783noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-600589111118264680.post-86310567184537125052010-09-21T10:11:49.880+10:002010-09-21T10:11:49.880+10:00Yesterday lol. It happens so bloody often!!!!!!Yesterday lol. It happens so bloody often!!!!!!Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07693773850422698445noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-600589111118264680.post-70199829549939202502010-09-21T02:24:34.748+10:002010-09-21T02:24:34.748+10:00When was the last time you saw multiple meltaguns ...When was the last time you saw multiple meltaguns or equivalent fail at killing a target within melta-range?VT2https://www.blogger.com/profile/13922615677851541327noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-600589111118264680.post-25582093624937152842010-09-20T14:27:35.615+10:002010-09-20T14:27:35.615+10:00In theory, for the one turn the Dread is exposing ...In theory, for the one turn the Dread is exposing itself to melta, you're smoked. So at least half of those shots will bounce off. Note also the free extra armor, so they can't just stun-lock the dread and keep it from charging them. If they melta and fail to immobilize or kill it, they're in charge range.tzeentchlinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07886812068265076783noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-600589111118264680.post-87567512840766630362010-09-20T04:47:47.872+10:002010-09-20T04:47:47.872+10:00But armor 13 that wants to get into combat is gonn...But armor 13 that wants to get into combat is gonna expose itself to melta.<br />That's a fact of life, and why the ironclad is such fail.<br /><br />I'm not all that much into mathhammer, but something tells me a rifleman dread in cover is gonna be lots more durable than ironclads rushing people for rapin' time, and have a much greater influence on the game, since you can't ignore them for two turns.VT2https://www.blogger.com/profile/13922615677851541327noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-600589111118264680.post-53770359988087653142010-09-20T04:19:24.917+10:002010-09-20T04:19:24.917+10:00Disagree with the Ironclads. Yes, they don't ...Disagree with the Ironclads. Yes, they don't like meltas. Neither do any other vehicles. However, that AV13 is great in combat - they can hold up things like TH/SS terminators much longer than a regular Dread, and things that rend have issues doing anything - and the extra attack is actually really useful since most of the time you're hitting on 4s. <br /><br />When combined with multiple other armor threats advancing up the field, the threat from meltaguns is lessened - not to mention not all armies have massed melta, or even melta at all. The AV13 is good against massed autocannons and even missile launchers compared to AV12. HK missiles can give it a ranged presence. They're great at busting other vehicles with the hammer giving +1 on the chart. They have a role that can be played in a given army. I would probably rate them as ok or good rather than poor.tzeentchlinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07886812068265076783noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-600589111118264680.post-77701156706304561292010-09-20T00:41:05.511+10:002010-09-20T00:41:05.511+10:00ANGRY MARINES KICK ASS!!!!ANGRY MARINES KICK ASS!!!!Dezzohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17376462378230683126noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-600589111118264680.post-47061420574495535682010-09-19T22:44:57.205+10:002010-09-19T22:44:57.205+10:00With BS 4 Plasma Cannon gets 2" or less scatt...With BS 4 Plasma Cannon gets 2" or less scatter 60% of the time. It is about 1/3 as effective against AV 11 as the TL Autocannon, but 4 times better at killing MEQ or Terminators. I find it a wonderful weapon for taking out Heavy Weapon teams even with cover.Lyracianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13021663969271276571noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-600589111118264680.post-51527311386097315042010-09-19T21:23:30.654+10:002010-09-19T21:23:30.654+10:00I don't like ironclads, periods.
They want to ...I don't like ironclads, periods.<br />They want to get in meltarange so they go poof faster.<br /><br />It's hurricane or melta-death, pretty much.<br />Alternatively, take a venerable/regular dread with autocannons instead.<br /><br />Remember, the cannon scatters, and you get cover now.<br />When I run them, I do so on the venerable. That way, it's gonna keep firing, and hiiting.<br /><br />Heavy bolters for 105 points are bad. For 40? Excellent.<br /><br />Linked las is just a stupid joke on all of us. So you pay 30 points, and your dread becomes worse at killing armor? Okay.<br />So funny, Mat Ward!VT2https://www.blogger.com/profile/13922615677851541327noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-600589111118264680.post-27499687367248177782010-09-19T16:10:22.938+10:002010-09-19T16:10:22.938+10:00I like Dreads, so usually take a few in my Marine ...I like Dreads, so usually take a few in my Marine lists. I have been finding the DCCW is lacking in usefulness as they just can not kill enough in combat so I'm planning to build myself some Autocannon arms.<br /><br />As for the primary weapon I am surprised to see you dismiss the Plasma cannon so easily! It is still strength 7 and while it is less effective against armour the AP 2 Blast it is much better at killing MEQ and hordes.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-600589111118264680.post-88968614682269184172010-09-19T15:46:16.575+10:002010-09-19T15:46:16.575+10:00I don't like the Hurricane bolter. You are rel...I don't like the Hurricane bolter. You are relegating the IC to being a poor infantry killer, whilst it tootles around 6"<br /><br />HFx2 seems unwise to me. A Mg is a beautiful thing, giving you a chance to open that transport before they get mugged by the IC, could give you the edge before assaulting another Dread, and can insta-kill annoying t4 things.<br />But you do need 1 HF to offset the lack on kill-quantity the Dread has for other things.Marshal Wilhelmhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08274955398809519542noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-600589111118264680.post-86272689358883211212010-09-19T14:16:42.591+10:002010-09-19T14:16:42.591+10:00Is the TLAC/DCCW Dread seriously even usable? I...Is the TLAC/DCCW Dread seriously even usable? I've never seen anyone run one and they don't seem all that useful. 105pts for an autocannon each turn? Not really impressive. Sure, it can defend itself in melee a bit better, but so what? Either take that second AC and be a specialist or keep the MM so you can at least wreck heavy armor.<br /><br />I'm still of the opinion that Heavy Bolters are trash. They're Autocannons that can't threaten MEQs, MCs, or light armor. Even twin-linked doesn't make them worthwhile here.<br /><br />The Las/Missile variant that a lot of people run isn't mentioned but is worth discussing in specific. It's bad (as implied by its nonpresence in the article) because it's expensive and is only a mediocre armor hunter while still being very vulnerable to return shooting.<br /><br />Ironclads are ridiculously tough in melee- the trick is getting them there. Double-flamers is interesting, but I think I'd rather keep the Meltagun. Hurricane Bolter is cute, but I'm of the opinion that you really shouldn't be shelling out that many points for a small number of shots like that. Hunter-Killers are interesting because it's a platform that can come in on a Drop Pod (in this case you don't necessarily need to be right behind the enemy in melta range.)AbusePuppyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07413248837734103198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-600589111118264680.post-31907296604532045752010-09-19T12:52:29.116+10:002010-09-19T12:52:29.116+10:00I think it is important on the MM Dread [and even ...I think it is important on the MM Dread [and even the Ironclad with Mg] to have a HF.<br /><br />Only B-Talons dreads rip through infantry in mêlée. DCCW are great for popping even hardcore things like TWC, MegaNobz, etc. but against grunts [below Tacs] the rate that you kill them versus their cost means the Dread gets tar-pitted.<br />The HF whoosh could kill 5 infantry, something that would take the Dread at least 2 turns in mêlée.<br />s5 means you can shoot av10 stuff too. Not brilliant, but a nice hors d'oeuvre above and beyond its Infantry killing roll.<br />HF also offsets, somewhat, charging into or operating around cover *whoosh*<br /><br />I look forwards to tl AC for Templars, and hope they get something like the Ironclad or Furioso.<br /><br />+++<br /><br />On the Ironclad: <br />Whilst marching into MELTA range is not great, if you can coincide it with something else getting there too, such as Hammernators, I feel they pressure is reduced on the Marine player.<br />i4 s10 attacks will do better against vehicles than s8 and, as always, having staggered initiative attacks reduces incoming attacks against slow guys. Hammernators ARE tough, but anything you can do to lighten the incoming heat is always a good thing. <br />You might just finish off that Carnifex, etc.Marshal Wilhelmhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08274955398809519542noreply@blogger.com