Well whilst I've been working on the BA version I went back to the SM codex and was seeing what I could pull together there. If we remember most lists here are essentially taking Dreads over more bikes but then suffer from lack of psy-defense (needings a MotF and Captain) so I thought to see if we can put a Libby in there without sacrificing too much in relation to the army.
HQ -
Captain w/Relic Blade, Bike
Libarian w/Bike, Null Zone, Vortex of Doom (or Avenger?)
Elites -
Dreadnought w/2x TL-autocannons
Dreadnought w/2x TL-autocannons
Dreadnought w/2x TL-autocannons
Dreadnought w/2x TL-autocannons
Troops -
Space Marine Bikes x8 w/2x meltagun, AB w/MM
Space Marine Bikes x8 w/2x meltagun, AB w/MM
Space Marine Bikes x8 w/2x meltagun, AB w/MM
Fast Attack -
Speeder w/MM & HF
Speeder w/MM & HF
Speeder w/MM & HF
Heavy Support -
Predator w/HB sponsons
Predator w/HB sponsons
Predator w/HB sponsons
Total: 2000
9 vehicles
9 vehicles
29 bikes
Looks pretty familiar yes? Less speeders and tacs replaced by Bikes with psy support. I think I'd prefer the Typhoons in place of the MM/HF speeders but I think the extra pred is better for saturation and leaves the speeders available to block if needed. If I could get this into BA for FNP bubbles...man :P but that's why they made it the way it is :(.
So thoughts? Can anyone see how to transfer this to the BA codex?
14 pinkments:
I was playing with a Libby earlier, and a couple times thought about Gate for contesting when he last until the late game. Now, he was in a Telion squad, in Termie Armour (no SS) as a bullet catcher - but it crossed my mind. Thoughts on Gate Kirbs?
Totally not hijacking - when I get BA FnS done, I'll tell you. ;)
Hey look, a shameless plug! lol I think Gate is only useful if an objective is left alone. Otherwise any nitwit worth his salt is just going to do a bit of spreading and then instant mishap is needed to contest which =/= a contest :p.
That looks nifty. I might not use as many Bikes (1 big squad and 3 smaller units, only 4 models less by mo' melta) and go for Typhoons, but at its core it's a solid list.
Gate can be fun, but like Kirbs said it can be countered. On a Biker Libby I may go for Might of the Ancients or whatevs, S6 +2D6 pen is handy in a pinch, or just stick with Avenger.
Those bikes look just like the ones Ron from FTW painted for me...
And as you must be able to tell I prefer to use a command squad. I do run without at times, but like to give one of the bike sarges a PF so that he and the capt can actually kill some things on the charge. The typhoons would be overkill on the long range firepower. You'll find that the MM/HF speeders work effectively by being close to the bikes to provide greater target saturation and that the HF works nice to soften up a unit before the bikers RF...
Ya for some reason they turned up with a Vulkan caption on Google...odd.
True, true, true and true to Slate :P. These I think pretty much all boil down to individual preferences. i.e. Pfists on bikes with combat tactics isn't a good place for them to be.
The problem with smaller bikes Chum is no combat squadding (also taking 3x5 + a big squad is 60 points more than 3 big squads for 3 more melta essentially and one less bike) unless you're playing with different squad sizes. This essnetially gives you 4-5 melta squads for your bikes whilst I can get 3-6 though your melta becomes more concentrated.
Strangely, Chaos Bikes with 2 Meltas are only 10 points more than BA Bike with 2 Meltas - at min size anyway. I presume BA and SM cost the same, but don't have the SM book at hand.
@TKE we're talking about vanilla marines right? Wouldn't do this with BA... Plus make sure you include Attk bike option as that is the big differentiator for me.
@Kirby Play them out a bit. Combat tactics is awesome as long as you are somewhere central, 3d6 fall back can be pressed to your opponents advantage.
Central point is actually that on a 4x6 board with 25%+ terrain makes it very difficult to just combat tactic with this army. Unless you combat squad you have a big footprint that is not very wieldy. What giving one of the sarges a PF does, is equip one of the squads to actually engage in CC w/ capt attached (you want to keep the Libby out of combat and buffing).
@Kirby - he also did a counts as Vulkan for me so I can cheese it up with the rest of my SM friends...
Absolutely, that's just it. At 3-men, with 2 Meltaguns, a 10-point difference for a better statline is fine - Chaos bikes don't need a bigger fix than an Attack Bike variant.
As for BA, there's a BA FnS below, and Kirby's determined to get it to work, lol.
I'll find a way TKE...I'll find a way. Slate can you link me to the Vulkan? Or everything he did =D? He does some nice work does Ron.
I would agree, love the work he does...
Stuff for my chapter
http://fromthewarp.blogspot.com/search/label/DIY%20commission
My Vulkan counts as
http://fromthewarp.blogspot.com/2009/11/character-banners-started.html
His stuff in general
http://fromthewarp.blogspot.com/2009/02/some-of-my-commission-work.html
1. List stealer :P
2. You can't Kirby. (Transfer to BA :P)
Problem with the Lib is he has no invul, I have begun to lean to NOT taking him for this reason. Though, in the short time I have run him, he's now getting Avenger/Vortex just to be a power-zapper. Null Zone hardly at all helps against what you wanna kill with it (Jetseers and TH/SS all die to focussed Biker bolters)
I also personally use Typhoons > MM/HF now. you need the range more against MC's and the new BA of HULK SMASH.
Combat Tactics OBVIOUSLY superior than lack of Combat Tactics for a biker army.
My 2k:
Capt - Bike/Relic/Hellfire Rounds/AA (AA because you could use it in wound allocations a lot more.)
3x Riflemen
3x Dakka Pred
3x LS Typhoon
3x 9 Bikes - 2 Melta, 1 MM (Fists on 2 Sarges)
So am tweaking it, trying to see what I can drop to get more bikes or more ranged firepower in.
This ain't your list :p. And you need to read everything prior to this Smurfy to get what I'm saying with the transfer lol.
No invul is fine, he's not running around as a combat dude or an SS dude so he's not there to suck up shots, he's to add a Hood and utility.
Ya I'd prefer typhoons I think but shall see what happens when you compare the extra speeder. And what is AA? (other than that silly 'support service' for alcoholics)
Null Zone was hardly utility when....10 effective hits are done a turn, and when I have to worry about invuls they're usually about 2/3 that many, jus' saying.
AA = Artificer Armour.
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