Email in: List help -1750 outflank marines

 

"Hi Kirby,

 

I have recently found your blog and am enjoying the tirades and information you are giving out.

 

Like everyone else over the last 2 days, I am chasing some list help. This is for QM3 up in Brissy. (If you are reading this Rob, Hi!)

 

I am looking at trying to build a 1750 null-deployment Vanilla Marines List based of Kor’sarro Khan for fun and (hopefully) profit.

My current lists run as: (1750)
Khan on foot (in LR)
Shooty Termies in Godhammer

3 tactical squads in rhinos (MM/Melta/PF, ML/flamer/PF, ML/Melta/PF)
Dread with TLAC/DCCW
Dakka Predator
2x Vindicators w/ dozer blades

The theory was to set up a hard castle to soften the enemy while the out flankers do their job and run riot in the backline.

It works GREAT against baby seals, but not so much against anything played well.

I am toying with putting Khan on a bike, and giving him a Bike Command Squad with Storm Shields and going down that path.

Also thinking of a foot command squad in a Razorback Stronos, or any number of other permutations.

 

I think the only way to successfully run an outflank army is to put a fire base down to annoy the oponent and draw attention.

I am open to suggestions, but unfortunately, the wife doesn’t think the bank account is, so I am fairly limited in the way of additions to this, but I am a capable convertor.
However, suggest what you like, I have a friend with boxes of old miniatures I can steal/borrow and use.

Minis I currently have:

Librarian
Black Reach Captain
2nd ed rhino: 4
New Rhino/Magnetised as Vindi: 2
Predator: 1 (LC turret / AC Turret, HB Spons)
Autocannon DCCW dread
4 bikes, 1 plasmagun bike, 1 chaplain on bike
Land Raider (Converted Arvus Lighter)
5 PF Terminator
1 PW Terminator
1 landspeeder
Tactical Marines:
Bolter x 38, Power Fist x 4, Power Weapon x 1, Chainsword x 1, ML x 2, MM x 1, Melta x 2, Flamer x 4, Lascannon x 2, Plasmacannon x 1, HB x 1, Plasmagun x 1

Oh, and some background for my playstyle: Ex-Ork player that runs/ran BW Blitz Lists (with Zogwart for random fun)
I am looking for something new and different to engage my WH40k mind, and a null-deployment army might fit the trick.
 

Anyway, any ideas that you can give me for a 1750 list that fits the bill would be great. I am happy to run something unconventional, and as I am an Aussie player, comp is a given in the tourney scene, so something that doesn’t look nasty, but has great synergy/is a little crazy and risky would be better than 6 dreads, 9 speeders and a dozen razorbacks in that regard.

Thanks in advance,

Matt"

 

Thanks for the e-mail Matt and glad you’re enjoying the blog and content. You’ve given me a tough proposal though! Very much a battle force army so hard to make something cohesive out of it hightlighted by this quote from Matt: "It works GREAT against baby seals, but not so much against anything played well." Luckily you’re playing via Australian comp (did I just say luckily…) so, I think with some changes we should be good. Now I know the wife doesn’t want you to access the bank account, but one or two purchases (I really recommend Wayland for Australian buyers, it’s basically 40-50% off from Australian prices or GamingDragon if you prefer local) could really help you build a list. Before we get onto my suggestions though, let’s discuss outflanking.

 

Outflanking is an okay concept for a couple of units only but on an army wide basis, really falls through. With outflanking you are forced to come in on a table edge which means your opponent is capable of blocking off said table edges with tanks or infantry meaning he dictates where you come in or can completely stop you from coming in. This is even before you've rolled for your side which means 33% of your army is turning up on the wrong side as your opponent refuse flanks you. Why does this then work for just a couple units? A significant portion of your army is still going to be in one area (midfield) so a unit or two ending up on the wrong side doesn't spell your doom (unless it's a 500+ pt unit) and for most armies it's generally not always feasible to block off a short table edge for just a couple units. 

 

So, what I want to suggest is changing from the Vanilla dex to the BT one and buy another box of Terminators. Here your shooty terms can be very effective w/2x assault cannon and tank hunters and you can get some decently effective Troops out of Crusader squads. Backed up by a couple of Speeders, Dreads or Preds and you'll have a decently balanced shooty force with a so-so assault core from your Troops. Would you be up for this at all? Or would you like me to stick to the Vanilla codex and what you have, and see if we can work something out?