"I'm sure there's a great article somewhere, but I can't find it, so I'm emailing you. Why, exactly are walkers so bad? I don't see them mentioned at all, anywhere. I realize they can be sort of an empty promise, but babysitting them with a guideseer gives you actually decent BS, and their rate of fire with scatter lasers seems pretty good for their points (best in the codex, in fact.) Is this a FOC thing? Something like I need my heavies for falcons or whatnot, so I should use vypers instead? I'm pretty new, and my local group isn't the most heavily meched (2 Dark Eldar players, an ork and a rhino-spamming SW), so maybe that's the reason.
For reference, here is the list I usually run (just so you have something to laugh at):
Eldrad - 210
Farseer - Guide, 75
Fire Dragons x5 w/Serpent (TL scannon, scannon) - 190
Fire Dragons x6 w/Serpent (TL scannon, scannon) - 206
Falcon (HF, scannon, scatter laser) - 175
2x Dire avengers x5 w/serpent (TL-lance, scannon) - 410 total
War Walkers x3 (6xscatter lasers) - 180
War Walkers x2 (2xscatter lasers, 2x scannons) - 100
1750 exactly."
War Walkers aren't that bad. I'm not a fan honestly but they are still a good unit. Problem for Eldar is as you pointed out, the Falcon and Prism are generally much more useful for the list as a whole. In Fast Attack they'd be a lot more useful as they can put out a lot of medium strength shots and can be guided. They are obviously weak in terms of survivability but helped by their squadron status. In terms of your list I'd want to get 5 DA for that Falcon and the WW up to 2 squads of 3 each. I'd drop Eldrad for that honestly for another seer and keep your BL Serpents back as well. I would prefer a Falcon/Prismx2 list but the War Walkers can still work. If you were going for a War Walker list though you might want to go for a pure S6 theme and cram as much S6 in as possible such as Vypers.
Kirb your enthusiasm!
"...generalship should be informing list building." - Sir Biscuit
Saturday, September 11, 2010
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
5 pinkments:
I'd be more inclined to drop the secondary Seer, myself. Leaves points for Stones, and still allows double-Guide, while keeping the much more valuable Doom. :)
They're bad because they're not falcons, but good because they solve some eldar problems.
Very bad because they cost a lot with the proper guns.
They have the most ranged firepower for the points in the Eldar codex. Compared to other Eldar units, they're fine, but it's when you look outside the book that they become also-rans, because when you're putting a unit in your army, you have to take into account all the possible things you can fight against, not just compare your unit to the other available units for the price. Lets do a quick comparison:
3 war walkers with 6 EMLs cost 210 points. They are AV10, but thankfully not open-topped, though they do suffer from low-AV-squadronitis. While they average only 3 missile hits from a round of shooting (without Guide), they can move and fire, which is nice for taking advantage of their good range.
6 Long Fangs with 5 missiles cost 140 points. They cannot move and fire, so you have to be more careful with their deployment, but their shooting is more effective, as they can split targets and hit more frequently. They are more durable against most weapons than the war walkers, when you factor in how easy it is to get them cover compared to the 3-inch-high vehicles.
In the match between Long Fangs and EML war walkers, the walkers will likely get the first shots, due to the capability to move and fire, but then the war walkers either die or are incapacitated by return fire. And they cost a lot more, and they have a high opportunity cost due to taking the same slot as a fire prism or falcon.
3 scatter laser walkers puts out more firepower in a lot of ways than 3 EML walkers. They get more pens against rhinos, and their target doesn't need to be bunched up to be effective for anti-infantry. However, their 36 inch range puts them into range to get torn apart by dakka preds, and they can't even scratch AV13. At 180 points they still aren't *cheap* but they are quite cost effective for the amount of str 6 firepower you get. I personally think their 36 range cripples them, however, as they are too fragile to survive return fire.
-willydstyle
Scatter Lasers are really the only gun on Walkers that scare me. They do what Eldar tend to do (spam S6 shots), but are able to do it from awkward positions and as a single, Guideable target. They have enough range and mobility to be a threat to most armies and vehicle status gives them at least limited survivability.
My big problem with War Walkers is their speed.
Everything else in a mechanized Eldar list can spontaneously relocate 24" in a turn, provided it can move.
Vypers can get a 12" move and still pop shots with one of their guns. (For reference, when I roll with Vypers I tend to go double Shuriken Cannon to keep cost down, and since I've got the speed to get there and use 'em, but I could see scatter laser/shuricannon). So can all the other tanks, though Wave Serpents can do 12" and get semi-anti-tank shots off.
War Walkers are nailing a foot to the ground in an army that's otherwise very mobile. If you want to support them, you've got a farseer nearby, and at least a unit (if not a transport) to shield the 'seer. They're also a huge amount of firepower on a reasonably-flimsy package, which makes them a priority. If I can kill 2-3 AV10 vehicles, I can knock out 4-6 heavy weapons?
That may seem odd coming from someone who'll use Vypers, but the main reason Vypers survive is because there's something scarier out there to shoot (IE: Grav Tanks). I believe the Walkers tip the scale, and anyone with a few autocannons (already the bane of Eldar because of range + strength + ROF) will happily spend some time popping a few Warwalkers and significantly cutting into your firepower.
Bottom line: Walkers are expensive and deadly, but are not too hard to kill, and killing them deprives you of serious firepower. Additionally, they're slow in an army that otherwise loves mobility.
Post a Comment