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Thursday, August 5, 2010

Email in: Hey! Help with Wolfwing [2000]


"Hey there!

I'm a 40k player with several armies that I'm very happy with, and I'm trying to do something different.

Thus, for the sake of the modelling experience, I want to make a Preheresy Space Marine list (not sure which chapter yet. I'm thinking maybe Emperor's Children...) featuring terminators.

Only Terminators.

Now, I know that pure-Terminator "Deathwing" armies aren't competitive at all, but I want to try and make the best/most competitive list I can with this handicap in mind. (Also, pure Terminators are probably as cheap as I'll get for an army...)

"Counts-as" Space Wolves, 2000 pts:

HQ:
275 "Logan Grimnar"
185 "Wolf Guard" Battle Leader in Terminator Armour w/ TH SS

Troops:
237 Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour
-SS PW
-SS PW
-Combi-Melta CF
-Combi-Melta CF
-Drop Pod

237 Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour
-SS PW
-SS PW
-Combi-Melta CF
-Combi-Melta CF
-Drop Pod

425 Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour
-"Arjac Rockfist"
-SS PW
-SS PW
-Combi-Melta CF
-Combi-Melta CF
-Drop Pod

320 Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour
-SS PW
-SS PW
-Combi-Melta CF
-Combi-Melta CF
-Combi-Melta CF CycloneML
-Drop Pod

320 Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour
-SS PW
-SS PW
-Combi-Melta CF
-Combi-Melta CF
-Combi-Melta CF CycloneML
-Drop Pod

Total 1999
25 Models
5 Vehicles

What do you think?

Thanks!
-Jeffrey"

As you said, it's not really that competitive and I think the Drop Pods and some extra wargear aren't really needed. Same with the WGBL. So if you're deadset on a full terminator list and won't use Long Fangs...well! =P. What I'd do is ensure you've got a Rune Priest in terminator armor over the WGBL. Not efficient but you need that psychic defense. Also drop the Pods. You've got a 2+ save and minimal model count so AP2 blasts aren't really going to damage you that much. Then get in a minimum of 6 squads of Wolf Guard with a CML each (make one squad 10 w/2 for Logan) and start adding models from there with a couple of PFists, SS, combi's, etc. You also have no need of Arjac, 170 pts for a W1 model is meh. Add some Lone Wolves as well as they can tie up units in combat and are very difficult to kill.

Again, if you're dead set on full terminator that's your best bet as you have mobile firepower from the CMLs and can just advance until you can punch things in combat whilst the Lone Wolves run in front. If you wanted to go a bit more competitive but keep the theme you could try and incorporate some Long Fangs (still keep full Termie armor on the WG) as this would provide a lot more firepower to your advancing terminators.

8 pinkments:

Chumbalaya said...

Ditch all the upgrades beyond CMLs and the occasional chainfist or storm shield. Add Lone Wolves for dealing with problem units. Keep your Termies cheap and get lots.

Fangs, TWC and a RP are all very useful addons.

VT2 said...

Needs a terminator rune priest.

Arjack destroys any chance of being competitive.
170 points? That's 5 unblinged terminators - a whole squad.

Battle leaders aren't really worth it.

Lone wolves are awesome. 85 points gets you the sacred combo; terminator armor, shield, chainfist. For added fun, run two.

For all-terminator armies, you want to maximize your units, and take as few characters and bling as possible.

If possible, keep the stormbolters.
It might not seem like much, but all those shots will do a whole lot of good during games, and make it so people can't just run away from you. Splash on shields for wound allocation fun, but don't overdo it - they're expensive.

So, basically, everything Kirby said, with some deathwing/grey knight wisdom tacked on.

Scott R said...

I've run a Deathwing since 3rd edition. The Landraiders are one of the keys to success. Also, a standard force commander is less helpful than a unit enhancer like a Chaplain or Librarian. In your case I suppose that would mean a rune priest.
I like to run Dreads, but they aren't totally necessary, as long as you maintain enough shooty power among your terminator cadre.

AbusePuppy said...

From what I've seen, Wolfwing works one of a couple ways:

-Walking, with Cyclone Missiles to provide shots as you advance. Here you're taking advantage of reasonably-cheap Termies (33pts?) to front them with a wall of dudes they can't easily handle. Not super-competitive, but pretty decent. You NEED fire support, though, and that means Land Speeders, Predators, or Long Fangs (with the latter being one of the most effective.)

-False Wolfwing, with squads of four dudes in Power Armor and one guys in Termie with CML and Chainfist. Back them with Fangs, as above, and you have a huge amount of mobile firepower. Some number of Combi-meltas are also obligatory to kill big stuff.

-Mechanized, using Land Raiders. Dunno how well this works, but it's the closest to "actual" Deathwing. You buy dudes and stuff them in transports and drive forward. There's not a lot more to it than that.

TH/SS is really, really expensive for Wolfwing, so I would avoid it most of the time- leave that to BA and SM, both of whom are ~20pts cheaper than you for that setup. Remember that Logan makes your fire support mobile or ridiculous (he can grant Relentless or Tank Hunters to them), so he usually wants to hang out back there rather than trying to make some sort of rock assault unit.

Lone Wolves are a good inclusion in the foot versions- they can't be ignored, but most people are loathe to try and kill them because it's a waste of firepower. Try and squeeze in two if at all possible.

Auretious Taak said...

May as well lend my 2 ents seeing as I am back in Sydney and have some more regular net access again (yes, yes, I know I should have responded to my last article of misunderstanding but also some gems of note, but net access being what it was and then off interstate well)...I digress. Try something a bit more solid in terms of the Termies Only. You STILL NEED SUICIDE MELTA units. As you don't want anything not in terminator armour and won't run mixed units where Wolfwing shines then try something like this:

HQ 1a) Logan Grimnar - 275pts

HQ 1b) Rune Priest, Living Lightning, Murderous Hurricane, TDA, Rune Weapon, Combi-melta - 125pts

HQ 2a) Rune Priest, Living Lightning, Murderous Hurricane, TDA, Rune Weapon, Combi-melta - 125pts

Elites 1) Lone Wolf, TDA, SS, CF - 85pts
Elites 2) Lone Wolf, TDA, SS, CF - 85pts
Elites 3) Lone Wolf, TDA, SS, CF - 85pts

5 WG, TDA, PW+SB, 3xCombi-melta+PW, PW+HF, Drop Pod w/SB - 220pts

5 WG, TDA, PW+SB, 3xCombi-melta+PW, PW+HF, Drop Pod w/SB - 220pts

5 WG, TDA, PW+SB, 3xCombi-melta+PW, PW+HF, Drop Pod w/SB - 220pts

5 WG, TDA, 4xSB+PW, 1xHF+PW - 170pts

5 WG, TDA, 4xSB+PW, 1xSB+PW+CML - 195pts

5 WG, TDA, 4xSB+PW, 1xSB+PW+CML - 195pts

Total = 2,000 points

36 Terminators, 3 Suicide Melta Units, good rounded force. Would do better as a mixed armour force, for a start the suicide melta units in pods become 165pts to be 4 PA guys, 1 combi-flamer, 3 combi-meltas, then a PW+HF TDA'er all in Pod. Save you a solid 55pts a unit, 165pts total is another 5 WG in TDA right there for example...

Auretious Taak said...

P.S. I am tired, change a murderous hurricane to something else. Also Arjac has 2 wounds not 1, but a Lone Wolf does a better job at half the cost in any case, or rather a pair for the same cost, heh. :)

Da Warboss said...

@Auretious: Your identical Run Priest powers make the list illegal.

Kirby said...

"P.S. I am tired, change a murderous hurricane to something else. Also Arjac has 2 wounds not 1, but a Lone Wolf does a better job at half the cost in any case, or rather a pair for the same cost, heh. :)"

It's like he knew what you were going to post a week in advance! Props for Taak.

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