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Thursday, August 5, 2010
Email in: Two 'Nids Enter, One 'Nid Leaves
So I am trying to decide which tyranid list I have wrote is the best. Again my meta is SM varients, Tau, Eldar and now Daemons thrown in.
List 1:
HQ: 350 pts
Hive Tyrant with Lash Whip/Bonesword, Heavy Venom Cannon, Old Adversary
2 Tyrant Guard with Lash Whips
Elites: 300 pts
2 Hive Guard
2 Hive Guard
2 Hive Guard
Troops: 490 pts
10 Termagants
Tervigon with Cluster Spines, Onslaught, Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs
10 Termagants
Tervigon with Cluster Spines, Onslaught, Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs
Fast Attack: 170 pts
Harpy with TL Heavy Venom Cannon, Cluster Spines
Heavy Support:
Tyrannofex with Rupture Cannon, Cluster Spines, Desiccator Larvae
Trygon with Adrenal Glandes
Trygon with Adrenal Glandes
1995 pts
List 2:
HQ: 410 pts.
The Swarmlord
2 Tyrant guard with Lash Whips.
Elites: 430 pts.
2 Hive Guard
2 Hive Guard
10 Ymgarl Genestealers
Troops:465 pts.
10 Termagants
10 Termagants
Tervigon with Cluster Spines, Onslaught, Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs
10 Genestealers with Adrenal Glands
Fast Attack: 210 pts.
6 Ravener Brood with devourers
Heave Support: 475
Tyrannofex with rupture cannon
Trygon with Adrenal Glands
Total: 1990
The first list, while a little vanilla, is definitely the stronger of the two by a long shot. It's got a good variety of anti-tank and can back it up with assault elements that few opponents will relish facing.
The second one has some serious problems. First of all, a single Tervigon at 2K is asking to get your troops cleaned off the board- Tyrands are not tough, remember, despite what many people think of 6W creatures. Some carefully controlled Lascannon/Missile fire and suddenly you're playing for the draw or wipeout, not a good situation.
It also lacks redundancy and has units all over the board (figuratively speaking); the Tyrannofex is woefully under-supported, being pretty much expected to kill tanks by itself. The Swarmlord and Genestealers want you to commit to a reserves game, but it really isn't equipped to do so. The Raveners have guns and thus can't easily Fleet to their targets (even with Onslaught, which has a fairly short range). All in all, it feels like you tried to fit too many gimmicks into a single list here and ended up with just a big mess of units. Several of these tricks could work by themselves, or even paired with a complementary other selection from the list, but all of them together is just a circus sideshow.
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5 pinkments:
The first list is strong, but I hate the HVC (I think it is completely worthless). So I would pick list two since it is closest to what I run.
Swarmlord is very strong and the Raveners (who really need Rending Claws) can take out tanks or tie up enemy shooting units. Keeping Gaunts in reserves to start and outflank the Genestealers will help to preserve troops longer.
The first list is far superior. Though I'm not completely sold on the two Trygons. They seem kinda out-of-place in an otherwise shooty army. Maybe drop one (or both) for another Tyrannofex or another Tervigon?
>The first list is strong, but I hate the HVC (I think it is completely worthless)
With all due respect, I would disagree. The HVC's job is to keep vehicles quiet so that your other units can get to them and tear them apart. And hey, sometimes it will kill something, too- that's a bonus. But you take it because it's 25pts for a S9 gun and Tyranids can't afford to be too picky.
If you desperately hate it and refuse to give it a whirl, twinned Devourers on both arms make a fine replacement, although you need to scrounge up 5pts to make the switch.
Raveners are a fine unit, but yes, they need RC and the gun is pretty pointless- it bumps their cost up to the point where they make a delicious, delicious template target. Genestealers are assumed to outflank (otherwise why run Swarmlord?), but they should at the very least switch over to Toxin Sacs.
I honestly don't think list two is very well-built. It lacks any guiding design principle other than "I <3 melee" and has poor redundancy and anti-tank.
I think we have had this discussion elsewhere. I do not see the HVC as any good even for suppression due to its low accuracy.
I would happily take the TL Devs, but if I was making changes I would not be playing either of these lists so there would be no point in choosing between them.
List one is just the New Nidzilla. Toughness Six spam as much as possible. Yes it is good but that does not mean it is interesting to play.
List Two reminds me very much of what MarksmanCypher on Warseer says he runs (Swarmlord with Ymgarls & Raveners) if I could just tweak the unit upgrade I would happily run the list.
The changes I would make to list two would be Toxic Sac on the Genestealers and Claws on the Raveners.
Matt's (MarksmanCypher) list is solid but lacks shooting power (which he readily admits) and adding in the 2nd or 3rd Hive Guard helps alleviate this to an extent. It simply owns the combat phase though :P.
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