Kirb your enthusiasm!


"Pink isn't a color. It's a lifestyle." - Chumbalaya
"...generalship should be informing list building." - Sir Biscuit
"I buy models with my excess money" - Valkyrie whilst a waitress leans over him

Friday, September 17, 2010

GWvsJohn is back,... and tired.

Miss me? Apparently, being a surgeon takes a lot of time. Who knew? Anyway, I think I've finally settled in and I think I can squeeze one or two posts and maybe a game of Vassal in each week. My plan is to resume the Chaos review. Before that, I'm going to drop a quick post about the army I'm planning to build to get some feedback and then my own version of the 1st and 10th list from earlier in the week.

So I'm going to buy (and paint, for once) a BA (Flesh Tearers) Jumpers list. Let's build the list, shall we? I'm going to start with Kirby's Jumper List which about as competitive as a pure jumper list can be. I want to tweak it to both make it my own and maybe fix some possible weaknesses. I think the list lacks a hammer. After the DS melta beta-strike (turn 2, get it?) there's nothing that really scares your opponent. The VV are a defensive unit and ASM can beat up Tacticals, but will still lose to dedicated close combat units. Luckily the BA Codex gives us a beautiful jumper hammer unit, the Sanguinary Guard. I want to add a squad of them. Normally a single hammer is a bad idea, but in this list the SG can drop behind the melta wall for protection (cover and range) and still be able to assault turn 3 (or after the drop). So I need to find 210 points (one power fist really makes a difference I think). What can we trim? My first thought is the LC on the Priests. 90 point, targetable 1 wound models make me a little worried. I know they will likely have to assault to get full Chalice use but I think the LC only makes them a bigger target. You're basically paying 15 points for 3 (one time) LC attacks. Not really worth it to me. That makes 45. Since we're adding 5 bodies, and high target priority bodies at that, I think we can afford to lose 5 ASM. Let's trim 1 squad down to 5 with Sgt, fist, melta, hand flamer. That saves 100 points. Only need to find 65 more. With a SG squad to "rescue" them I think the VV can afford to lose a shield each. 40 more, only need 25 more. (as an aside, Kirby, how would you divide up the equipment for your 4SS, Glaive, PF VV squad or my 3SS, Glaive, PF VV squad?) I think the hand flamers have to be sacrificed next. The army will be without templates, but s3 really isn't scary, without Tank Shocks to bunch things up templates lose effectiveness and I trust FNP ASM to handle hordes. That leaves me 5 under, so let's add melta bombs to one of the VV in case they run into tanks. Here it is

HQ -

Libby w/Jump Pack, Blood Lance, Shield of Sanguinius

Libby w/Jump Pack, Blood Lance, Shield of Sanguinius

Honor Guard w/4x meltaguns, Jump Packs

Elites -

3x Sanguinary Priest w/Jump Pack

5x Sanguinary Guard w/PFist

Troops -

10x ASM w/2x meltaguns, PFist

10x ASM w/2x meltaguns, , PFist

5x ASM w/meltagun, PFist

Fast Attack -

5x Vanguard Veterans w/Jump Packs, Glaive, 3x SS, Power Fist

5x Vanguard Veterans w/Jump Packs, Glaive, 3x SS, Power Fist

Totals: 2000 points

50 Jumpers

I trade 5 scoring marines, some IC PW attacks, 3 templates and some defense for a nice 5 man hammer. I think the trade is worth it. Objectively, Kirby's list is probably superior, but my version fits my play style better.

Now for the 1st and 10th. Cool theme (Gav Thorpe's army back in 2nd ed) and I think it can be decently competitive. Let's do it my way. Start with the 1st

400 - 10 TH/SS Terminators

125 - Libby - Terminator, Null Zone, Gate

Thundergate (suck it Kirby) in effect.

Now the 10th, I know we want Storms and I think they help the list.

195 - 3x LS Storm - multi-melta

And fill 'em

360 - 3x 5 Scouts - PFist, combi-melta, 3x shotgun, missile launcher

I think the extra shot pre charge is better than the extra attack in CC and the ML gives the squad some threat if they find themselves stranded. We need more scoring bodies and shooty scoring at that.

147 - 5 Scouts - Telion, camo cloaks, 3x sniper rifle, missile launcher

Telion is a no-brainer for a shooty scout squad. I think 1 more scout squad is needed to act as buffer/speed bump and overall pest. They can infiltrate/scout move as need to bother the enemy while Telion claims near objectives and the Storm assault far. Let's keep this one cheap.

85 - 5 Scouts, 4x sniper rifle, missile launcher.

Despite VT2's Sternguard recommendation, I think it's time for the actual must-buy in the SM Codex. Once you have your troops, your HQ and your "theme" down, fill the rest of your elites (as points allow) with Riflemen. They're too good to bring anything else. 4 twin-linked light vehicles/MC busting shots, 6" move and fire, can tie units up in CC, need I go on? They're the best unit in the SM army as far as I'm concerned. Let's add 2

250 - 2 Dreads - 2x TL autocannon

Now we're at 1562 and we need to think. Our biggest need is long range fire support. Typhoons would be nice, but FA is full. Preds are an option. We can fit 3 AC/LC Preds and still have almost 80 points left. It's an option, but Vanilla AC/LC leave me unsatisfied. I see another possibility. Let's start with

120 - Master of the Forge - conversion beamer

Adds some punch to Telion's squad (which now has 2+ cover I believe), but more importantly, now we can add

250 - 2 Dreads - 2x TL autocannon

More dakka :) We have 68 left which can be spent however. I'd go with

15 - SS for Libby

20 - 4x melta bombs for the attack Scouts and the annoy Scouts

30 - 2x Teleport Homer for the attack Scouts

Final list

Libby - Terminator, Null Zone, GoI, SS

MotF - Conversion Beamer

10 TH/SS Termies

4 Rifleman Dreads (2 as HS)

3 LS Storm - multi melta

5x 5 Scouts

A, B - PFist, combi-melta, melta bombs, teleport homer, missile launcher, 3x shotgun (or combat blade)

C - PFist, combi-melta, melta bombs, missile launcher, 3x shotgun (or combat blade)

D - Telion, camo-cloaks, missile launcher, 3x sniper rifle

E - missile launcher, 4x sniper rifle

Hope every enjoys this :)

9 pinkments:

Brother Loring said...

Man... 2 surgeons on one blog! Check out 3++!

What sub-specialty (if you've decided already)?

*reads article*

Chumbalaya said...

Welcome back duderino.

I'm a big fan of the Sanguinary Guard. I don't know if 3 SPs and HG are necessary (my Bloodwing gets by with 2 and an HG, but it is fewer models) so maybe you could fit in more marines if you need to.

1st and 10th looks neat, just don't expect those Storms to last very long :P

Scott R said...

What PGY are you? I'm a 4th year Med student myself.

GWvsJohn said...

PGY 1 (1st year intern) in General Surgery. I haven't picked a subspecialty yet, but I'm interested in Trauma and Colorectal.

fester said...

Yay, GWvsJohn stole, err, improved my 1st and 10th :)

Seems like you got a better response than I did!

Brother Loring said...

Cool... I was a big fan of colorectal through Med School.

I'm a Urology trainee now though... our system doesn't have interns/residents - I'm a senior house officer (4th Yr out of med school).

Best of luck Scott!

Kirby said...

I deal with feelings blargh.

It's nice to have you back GWvsJohn but get the scheduling right! *wanders off to strangle Taak*

GWvsJohn said...

No comment on either of my lists? No answer to my question? Way to foster discussion, Dr Pinkenstein. :)

Kirby said...


I like your Jumper list. Might steal it ;P. Though youdon't really need 3 Priets + HG squad so can free up some points with fiddling I imagine. Could compress two Priests into an HG squad but those have pretty high target priority for most opponents.

1st & 10th...well it's a 1st and 10th called Thunderbubble not Thundergate :P.

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