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"...generalship should be informing list building." - Sir Biscuit

Friday, March 25, 2011
Guest Article: Learning to love losing
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Wow that TKE fella sure is on a roll. He decided to loan me this article which he recently posted on his blog. Nice of him but it really outlines a point which I think a lot of people forget or ignore. Losing gracefully is important.
In order to be a Competitive Player of this game, this is a skill you require.
In order to be a non-Competitive player of this game, this is a skill you require.
In order, basically, to not be a dickhead - this is a skill you require.
No-one LIKES losing, in of itself, of course. It's ingrained in our genes - feeling like a failure isn't something any of us set out with the ambition to do, and it hurts.
However, losing is simply the best way to learn. If you steamroll all your opponents with your list, then find better opponents, or tweak your list slightly. Maybe they are intimidated by your army/reputation? Swap armies. Mix it up. Hell, buy a new army, whatever.
If you never find yourself taxed in games then you will not only never improve, you will probably stagnate and get worse. When a player eventually DOES come along who is better than you (and it will happen eventually, unless you quit first) you will be the one getting rolled...and you will almost certainly be a bad loser from your lack of familiarity with it.
Often in my articles, I have a thought and segue off into a tangent loosely connected to something I just said. I'm trying to cut down on that rambling a bit, but this must be said - a LOT of Comp-based environments stem from this sort of thing. People who think they are awesome get a harsh slap of reality in the face, and react in the wrong way.
If you lose, the first thing you must look to blame isn't the dice, isn't the system, isn't the opponent, isn't their 'cheesy' army, the weather, the alignment of the stars, or even your horror over the worst song ever [thanks a LOT Rebecca Black, I will never get those 3 minutes back...]
Blame YOURSELF.
And then, be a fucking adult, and deal with it.
Sure, any or all of those could be factors in your defeat.
However, the list one is also YOUR fault, not theirs. If someone takes a more competitive list than you, and you don't think that is 'fair' somehow, then you should have revised your expectations at the outset of the game. Even if, in your arrogance, you didn't bother to read their list before the game began, you should have THOUGHT at Deployment.
If it's a friendly game, no-one is forcing you to play if you KNOW your list isn't able to compete, and you can't stand losing. In a Tournament game? Man the fuck up, dicksack. If you're playing a sub-par list in a Tourny, then you shouldn't expect to win every game. I'm not slabbering, but Stelek of YTTH, more than most players, likes to say he's very good at the game - but does he then take a sub-par list to Tournies to further prove his leetness? No, he fucking does not. [Note - Stelek VERY clearly IS a very good player. No drama here!]
Ahem.
There are a number of excellent articles on places in my BlogRoll about managing your expectations before the game, so I'm not going into that in any detail - but it IS vital. Know what you want from a game before it starts, and ASK YOUR OPPONENT what they want if unsure.
If you want a tight, hard-fought, challenging Competitive game, then go for it. That's what I enjoy. Sure, everyone likes to table the guy who always moves too far and is 'hazy' on rules, years into the Edition - but that's a very temporary pleasure, that mostly comes after, not during, the game.
If you want to tell a tale of derring-do and gallantry and stuff...play WFB. :p
Nah, but if you want an Epic Story of a game, make that clear, and be aware it requires BOTH players deliberately sacrificing tactical ability in the name of 'fun' - something that is entirely subjective, and can still be readily ruined by the dice. If you want an EPIC FIGHT between Logan and Draigo, but can only reach to charge that Halberd-armed GK between you and DRAAAAAAIIIIIIIGGGOOOOOOOOO, then get splatted by the Force Weapon? Suck it up. Yes, it ruins the spectacle, but don't be a dick by saying so.
Does that cover it?
Are we clear?
If you don't want to play Competitively, it is your choice, and you should learn to expect losses against those who do, and should roll with them. It IS just a game after all, as Srs Bsnus as Warhams is, you have to go with it, and not be That Guy...or you create a system that punishes players who have a different mentality, group together with like-minded individuals, and enforce this way of playing on half a continent. Who's the bad guy again?
If you DO want to play Competitively, then relish losses more than wins. People judge you on how well you take losses, especially when they know you were aiming for a competitive battle - and it doesn't matter if you got trashed. In fact, if you thought you had a decent list, and got trashed by an inferior list, then you SHOULD take yourself off for 10-15 mins after the game. Have a coffee, smoke, beer, whatevs. Have a bun or cookie, treat yourself.
While you're off chilling, get a pen and paper, or a dictaphone if you're snazzy like that, and record EVERY single thing you think you did wrong. After that, find your opponent, and ask for their opinion on what you could have done better. Compare these notes, either with them, or later if your pride prevents this (get over it) and build on these flaws in your game. Strength Through Adversity.
If you win, it is a LOT harder to notice mistakes, and even HARDER to be sure of them. Knowing you didn't play perfectly in a win is easy, but pin-pointing it takes a laser-sharp focus that most people aren't capable of. I can do it sometimes, but I don't mean that in a boastful way - I've had a LOT of practice trying to do it. Even then, often as not I find myself unable to be sure...or, worse, unconcerned.
Learn to Love Losing, because Without Losing, Learning is Limited.
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Guest Article: Learning to love losing
2011-03-25T22:39:00+11:00
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Random|Warhammer 40k|Warhammer Fantasy|
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Rawrtime 31p · 735 weeks ago
You couldnt be more right, most people just dont know how to lose.
In my game against Dan at Centurion the first few rounds were BEYOND brutal for him, as my shooting just couldn't go wrong which caused much angst and some joking mentions if he should just throw the towel in. The funny this is that he ended up winning the game on the last turn, which had me kicking myself for all the stupid stuff i had done (even before first turn with my choices for KP's) so i suppose neither of us were very 'good losers' in that game. But i did learn alot, Dan is an exceptional Tau player and he deserved that win and i am really glad that i was taught a lesson about how brutal a defensive/denial Tau army can be. This was a big learning curve for me, and i feel that in the future i will be a better play for it.
TheWolfsLunch 61p · 735 weeks ago
Rawrtime 31p · 735 weeks ago
Kirby 118p · 735 weeks ago
I do agree though :) .
TheKingElessar · 735 weeks ago
Once. :P
erwos · 735 weeks ago
But what I _always_ try to do in those scenarios is point out tricks and tactics they can use to increase their efficiency, as well as spots in their list that might require some tweaking. The whole 2" disembarkation radius is huge for armies doing transport rushes - and new players often miss that until it's pointed out to them. Ditto for turbo-boosting, moving through terrain, bringing anti-armor guns, etc. If they're going to lose (and they usually come into the game with this assumption, to be fair), both players need to be sure the game was worth their time. I enjoy teaching, and I'm very happy to say that the younger guys at the store enjoy learning; they may lose, but the next time you play them, they've upped their game considerably. I know some vets who could take lessons from them...
TheWolfsLunch 61p · 735 weeks ago
The objective of the game is to win.
The point of the game is to have fun.
Kirby 118p · 735 weeks ago
I think 'high-minding' it and trying to make the game as tough as possible for you is meh. I know a lot of people who feel upset or annoyed that you tried to make it as tough as possible for you in terms of the environment but still won or if they won they would feel their win wasn't justified. I'd much rather help them through games early on (if they wish it) and have them go against a good list/player with appropriate terrain/missions/etc than shimmy the game.
erwos · 735 weeks ago
I gave up the first turn, too. Man, I'm a jerk! :)
gundog8324 · 735 weeks ago
Sethis · 735 weeks ago
abortedsoul · 735 weeks ago
TheKingElessar · 735 weeks ago
Marshal_Wilhelm 61p · 735 weeks ago
I'm not talking about how you only needed that 2+ roll, though that is true too. Wouldn't you feel jipped if you would have won had it not been for a 2+ being made? I would.
I wouldn't rant over it, but I'd still be sad because of it.
Then there are those games where you could have brought more points to the show than your foe and the dice still saw you lose. That is what I am really talking about.
Generally, if your foe is a reasonable bloke and *he* says the dice cheated you, then the dice have cheated you.
I don't see how acknowledging bad rolling is looking for a scape goat.
+++
If you play Blood Bowl, you can get totally taken out of the game by bad dice, even if you have stood all your men up, moved the free men, done 2D blocks with block, etc. as once you fail a roll, your turn is over.
Whilst 40K is not as severe, if you lose 10 Marines to 10 bolter wounds, you have been jipped.
I haven't read the whole thing through and mused over it, and am going out for my nephew's birthday dinner.
I'll be back to fight those who defy my authoritai, don't worry.
Lol
TheKingElessar · 735 weeks ago
abortedsoul · 735 weeks ago
It is good to be aware that dice can swing a game either way. You can try to mitigate this, and ultimately success or failure usually rests more on your shoulders than on chance, but sometimes the dice gods just don't smile on you.
abortedsoul · 735 weeks ago
Samosaurus · 735 weeks ago
I find that in games where I lose because I didn't prioritise fire or moved into a bad position, I am more satisfied with my loss, because I have learnt what not to do. But in games where my opponent got kills from everything he shot and destroyed anything that wasn't BLoS, I don't know what to take away from it and it can be frustrating. The other day I saw a friend fail 10/11 4+ saves. No matter how good you are at predicting risks and future moves, the results are up to dice rolls, and dice rolls are inherently random. All we can really do is reduce how much of an influence they have on our results (by playing intelligently), but in the end, that influence can never be reduced to zero.
That being said, ridiculous dice rolls can make for insanely hilarious games (even more so if you find the humour in your opponents lone fire warrior killing your special character for example).
TheKingElessar · 735 weeks ago
General Smooth · 735 weeks ago
The thing I would add though is to acknowledge the opponent when you win. There are basic things like acknowledging dice, either good for you or bad for the other. Furthermore there is acknowledging your opponent's tactical attempts and how the game would have been different if this or that had even gone slightly better for them. The last and potentially most important is to acknowledge your opponent's attempts to overcome what went wrong - their regrouped counter assault, their cunning but brave spearhead assault when the game seemed over - just their general persistance to attempt to get back in the game. Sure if you think they would like to hear it give advice but most importantly let them know that it wasn't the winning you enjoyed but playing against them. This way, they will always feel their presence is welcome at the table wether they beat you or not and you will continue to have people to play who like playing you.
TheKingElessar · 735 weeks ago
Regarding swearing, it's just the way I talk. *Shrug*
Kirby 118p · 735 weeks ago
TheKingElessar · 735 weeks ago
Zjoekov 74p · 735 weeks ago
In any case, good article. Mandatory stuff to know in order to not be 'that guy'.