Email in: Biker list!

Wednesday, May 4, 2011

Email in: Biker list!

Posted by Unknown

"Hello again,

Back to the "something with Bikes" list V 0.1!

Don't be worried with dates, this is a long term project...Same Tournament, same date...December is the deadline!

This Tournament has a particular set of rules, in particular, a Squadron of Vehicles worth 1 KP for each vehicle... Tournament Missions are as Rulebook...so lets avoid squadrons!

I had the lucky to "acquire" a large quantity of 2handed space marine bikes (+/- 30...), a couple of Speeders and a pair of AoBR Dreads...

Not a big fan of Dual Command Biker Army, so no need to emphasize how awesome they are!

So...lets keep ti cheap!

Captain on Bike and Relic Blade

Librarian on Bike Null Zone and Avenger (or MoA)

Command Squad on Bikes x5 w/ Champion,3xSS, 2xLC, 2xMG and PF

Space Marine Bikes x8 w/2x meltagun, AB w/MM

Space Marine Bikes x8 w/2x meltagun, AB w/MM

Space Marine Bikes x8 w/2x meltagun, AB w/MM

Land Speeder Typhoon

Land Speeder Typhoon

Dreadnought w/2x TL-Autocannons

Dreadnought w/2x TL-Autocannons

Total: 2000 Pts

A couple of options:

1) A Chaplain instead a Librarian? The Librarian is more a utility tool Vs the Chaplain Command Squad CC augmentation;

2) 2xLand Speeder Typhoon Vs 3xLand Speeder MM. Kind of "I'll have to try both" here;

3) 2xDreadnought w/2x TL-Autocannons Vs 3xPredator AC/2xHB; Coolness factor goes to Rifledread!

4) Kind of Fast'N'Slow. Drop both typhoon for 3xSpeeders w/ MM and Rifledread for 3xDakkaPreds

Thanks!
Luís"

1) either works fine to be honest. With the single squad you want to be reliable in combat which the Chaplain provides but you're also a single rock which the Libby helps defend against.
2) Typhoons. You've got fast melta, you need fire support.
3) Another either or choice really. Dakka Preds increase your anti-infantry which you don't need too much help with thanks to all of your guns whilst the Dreadnoughts are better at dropping tanks at range or at least suppressing them.
4) Keep the Typhoons. Only changes I might make would be to run the Dreads as MM Dreads for combat support but they are slow so I think it's fine as is. However, Making one of the large Bike squads a smaller squad and giving the Sarges on the larger squads PFists and upping the Command squad to 3x LC and adding more SS (i.e. Captain) is important as well.

Comments (14)

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Inquisitor Ixe · 730 weeks ago

One thing I'm gravitating toward with my bikers is something I haven't seen before--4 man squads with 2x melta +1 attack bike w/multi melta. This qualifies as a 5 man squad to count as Troops--technically, 3 guys +1 attack bike might qualify, as the rulebook suggests that a full squad of 7 + an attack bike = a 10 man squad, but I won't rules lawyer it up.

This mini squad costs 185, while the full squad costs 275. Per combat squad, the full squad costs 142.5, a savings of 42.5 points per squad. Those are significant savings, but you're left with half as many melta weapons! Two mini squads costs an extra 95 points, but they have 4 meltas and 2 multi-meltas, while the combat squads save you 95 points but have 2 meltas and one multi-melta. The mini squad costs you 61.66 points per melta weapon, while the combat squad costs you 91.66 points. So, while the mini squads are costlier, per meltagun they are cheaper. In other words, if you want to maximize your melta fire, mini squads are actually more efficient.

6 replies · active 730 weeks ago

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Kirby 118p · 730 weeks ago

Mini squads have been used before and are generally there when you don't have the points for a full squad. Remember as well the mini-squad is more likely to generate over-kill and when you have combat squads, the AB portion has greater threat range for a reduced priced. Smaller squads are great but I would always be looking to take two large Bike squads in a a biker army depending upon points.

-1 Vote up Vote down

Ajax · 730 weeks ago

Under C :S M, the smallest possible Space Marine Bike Squad, with two meltaguns and an attackbike, is the base three man squad and the attack bike. You can only break a Space Marine Bike Squad into demisquads when it is "purchased" at full strength - 8 bikes and an attack bike. This is pretty much why C :S M bikes squads only see the light of day as 3, 3+AB, and 8+AB squad sizes.

0 Vote up Vote down

Inquisitor Ixe · 730 weeks ago

Are you saying that 3 guys + attack bike = 5 models for counting as Troops? Because that's important in a biker-based army.

0 Vote up Vote down

wisdom like silence · 730 weeks ago

No, it isn't, unless his twisted version of the world interprets an attack bike model as two models (it is not). The smallest scoring bike squad is 5 bikes or 4 bikes+AB.

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Ajax · 730 weeks ago

Yep; but 5 bikes or 4 bikes+AB is not all that effective a use of points in most lists; better to buy the full 8+AB squad and then break them up into demisquads. Take a gander at C: SM, page 68, when a full size bike squad is split into combat squads "the Attack Bike counts as two models[.]"

In a 8+AB squad, the attack bike is one model. In a 3 to 7 +AB squad, the attack bike is one model. But as soon as you split into demisquads, presto, "the Attack Bike counts as two models[.]"

Both demisquads will count as scoring (if the unit began life asa scoring it can be reduced to as little as one doodmenz and still score), but that little "counts as two models" rule has all sorts of other uses.

+2 Vote up Vote down

wisdom like silence · 730 weeks ago

It's an effective use of points if your goal is to increase the number of meltaguns in your list. In your example, half of the bike squad is good for little other than scoring.

I'm pretty sure everyone understands how combat squads work, no need to belabor the point.

+1 Vote up Vote down

Ajax · 730 weeks ago

> "This Tournament has a particular set of rules, in particular, a Squadron of Vehicles worth 1 KP for each vehicle[.]"

Wow. Just... wow. That is an amazingly bad rule. Why must tournaments always #%^$ with the game as it was written? I don't claim to be a great player, but I wonder just how good some "tournament champions" actually are as the never seem to play the actual game. Doubling or tripling the points awarded for knocking out a squadron, no doubt simply because squadron rules make 6" range metlaguns slightly less effective, is just plain dumb. I think Kirby once refered to this as "Special Olympics Warhammer."

Okay, rant over.

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Luís · 730 weeks ago

Thanks for the comments!
I have a typo in the list...all Bike squads Sarge have a Power fist. But the small squad suggestion is valid, though! I'll see what I can include. An extra Typhoon and a couple SS would be nice!

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wisdom like silence · 730 weeks ago

I would drop the Champion for another veteran with Storm Shield and Lightning Claw. The Champion's WS5 doesn't make up for the fact that power weapons are worse than lightning claws, and his combat shield is just terrible compared to a storm shield. I would also encourage you to leave off the powerfists on your squad sergeants, for the same reason you should leave them off tactical sergeants - bike squads don't belong in combat, you should be aiming to lose so you can get out with Combat Tactics.

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Luís · 730 weeks ago

Playing with a small Bike squad instead of a 3rd full bike squad, I get this:

Captain, Bike, Relic Blade, Storm Shield, Artificer Armour
Librarian, Bike OR Chaplain on Bike
5xCommand Squad, Bike, 2xMG, 3xLC, 3xSS,1xTH
2x 8xBike, 2xMG, PF, Att Bike c/ MM
4xBike, 2xMG, Att Bike c/ MM
3x Land Speeder Typhoon
2x Rifle Dread

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Smurfykins · 730 weeks ago

A way you can work on a Biker Hybrid to get the needed Combat punch over the deathstar (Command Squad on Bikes) syndrome is MM/HF Dreads I find. Their fists help a ton in a pinch.

2 replies · active 730 weeks ago

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wisdom like silence · 730 weeks ago

How do you feel about TL-auto/dccw dreads? It's not like bike lists lack melta and it seems like it would be nice to have some longrange suppression against some lists.

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Luís · 730 weeks ago

I've made a couple of test games at 1750 pts with Rifle Dread...and I'm a bit disappointed! They are slow (...duh!) and their volume of fire only help against transports and such...

Single Command Squad is a Deathstar = Target on forehead... a couple of bad rolls and your are done!!

I feel I need more combat punch.

Since I was planing to convert a couple of AoBR Dread...I will try them with MM/HF in Drop Pod.