I normally hate these type of posts and avoid writing them like the plague. Most of these type of articles just end up complete whining or asshatery (though I did love SandWyrm's) which isn't really necessary but what has happened recently has lead me to write this. Before we get to the letter though some information. Games Workshop has changed their terms and conditions for stores in the United Kingdom to only allow shipping to countries within the European Union and other parts of Europe. They have increased their prices again come June and have announced the released of resin and mixed resin/plastic sets instead of metals with an approximate increase of 2.5-25% depending upon the set. None of these sets are new but rather re-casts.
Letter time!
To Games Workshop,
Why? No seriously, why? I'm sure the excuse of cutting off Australasia and other countries (Canada, India, Korea, South American countries, etc.) to benefit the independent and GW store sales in Australia sounded good but unless you cut the prices here to not be a ridiculous 200% higher price than overseas, it's not going to happen. Let's look at this logically. You've stopped us from buying from stores like Maelstrom and Wayland with an embargo agreement in your Terms and Conditions (remember globalisation? how's that going btw?). Does this mean we are going to now buy at RRP in Australia or other countries? No.
There are other outlets overseas we can buy from which are still much cheaper (hi America), other companies which you cannot touch without raising a helluva lot of crap (hi ebay) and people who are willing to ship to us overseas (hello family and friends) without the 200% tax. We won't be getting as huge a discount as before but it's much better than buying here at RRP. The other option is of course going to be quitting which I imagine some people are going to do. Check out this thread on WargamerAU where a lot of people are indicating they are. The ultimate bottom line? Your bottom line suffers (more people leaving) and the retailers in Australia do not benefit.
Now I'm all for one in supporting the locals. I buy all my products such as spray paint, paints, plasticard, magnets, drills + bits, modelling putty, brushes, etc. from Australia. As an aside, do you actually stock good quality merchandise for all of those options? I don't see you selling plasticard, magnets, good sized drillbits, custom bases, etc. I'd be happy to pay a 5-10% premium on these objects compared to other stores to support your business but then again, I don't really want to support your business currently do I? The point of any business is to make a profit but the problem with your business model is you do not do this whilst concurrently supporting your customer base. We don't ask for much but a short list would look like...
- not raising prices every year, without fail, regardless of the economic situation or inflation rates
- basing prices around the world upon exchange rates (I wouldn't be averse to paying 20% more in Australia compared to the UK or America locally but I am adverse to paying twice as much) - there are circumstances in each country that make operating there more or less expensive but you need a base retail price for your product which is then translated by exchange rates at a given time (i.e. quarterly) rather than a price set many, many years ago. It's part of being in a global market.
- regular and quick FAQs - you've done a fantastic job IMO of creating some pretty balanced books for 5th edition, fix the grey areas quickly.
- official erratas - man up and admit you've made mistakes (hi Tyranids) and work on erratas that are official and re-print the books with these amendments. Admitting a mistake and fixing it isn't a problem and I'd applaud you for it. Ignoring a problem is.
- fix Fantasy - you did it with 40k, why go backwards with Fantasy?
- don't think your customer base is moronic - the resin re-cast to be cheaper than metals whilst hiking prices, not fooling anyone.
Ultimately people in Australia and other countries go overseas for their Games Workshop products for a reason: it's significantly cheaper (I.e. half price). What motivation is there to therefore buy from our locals when you aren't treating your customers with loyalty and support? People will walk away and your bottom line will hurt. A simple solution: care about your customers. Change the Australian (and other countries) prices so they are at least similar to the UK and US. This doesn't have to be the exact same price but some parity would be greatly appreciated.
Here's a quick example. If you could buy a similar product for $45 compared to $150, what would you do? How about if the product was the exact same but if you ordered it overseas it was $80 compared to $150 by the time it reached your door step? I'm pretty sure you'd want to take the cheaper option correct? For you as a company, you make your profit margin through the reseller regardless of where it is purchased. You may make more money off a direct sale at an Australian store compared to an Internet sale from the UK but you have already achieved the profit margin from the Internet sale already. The Australian stores may be hurting but this is down to the initial price you have set, not market trends. Simply put, you are alienating customers from a large and developing market.
I and many of the readers here obviously enjoy your game. We've played it through thick and thin (4th edition...) or come back thanks to an improvement game balance (5th edition) and don't want to leave. We will though sooner or later if you keep piling on idiotic choices on us. Other companies like Privateer Press did very well in the early to mid-2000s for a reason and people will migrate to other gaming systems if you continue to mistreat them and their loyalty.
As it stands I question why you do the things you do. Raising prices every year annoys me but I cannot complain too loudly as your products are a luxury item but you do not provide excellent customer service one usually expects with such goods. I certainly find minimal fault with your staff or when your product is damaged/faulty but your overarching business model seems counter-intuitive to maintaining a customer base. Even if you are getting a large amount of new customers imagine how much better off your company would be if you had maintained a significant portion of your repeat customers. The model you are running currently to me does not seem sustainable as your turnover rate in customers is just too high. I applaud your efforts in making 40k 5th edition a more competitive game but what you've done to Fantasy 8th edition doesn't bode well for the future.
Please, look to satisfy both the shareholders and the customer rather than just the former.
Kirby.
P.S. Anyone who agrees with this, I would greatly appreciate this being re-posted on your blog so we might actually garner GW's attention and hopefully move forward together. That is the ultimate goal, I want Games Workshop to succeed as a company so I can continue to enjoy the gaming systems I do but to do that, Games Workshop must look at altering their business model in the long run to maintain a steady customer base.
P.P.S. keep it civil in the comments kids and don't bitch, discuss.
Here's a quick example. If you could buy a similar product for $45 compared to $150, what would you do? How about if the product was the exact same but if you ordered it overseas it was $80 compared to $150 by the time it reached your door step? I'm pretty sure you'd want to take the cheaper option correct? For you as a company, you make your profit margin through the reseller regardless of where it is purchased. You may make more money off a direct sale at an Australian store compared to an Internet sale from the UK but you have already achieved the profit margin from the Internet sale already. The Australian stores may be hurting but this is down to the initial price you have set, not market trends. Simply put, you are alienating customers from a large and developing market.
I and many of the readers here obviously enjoy your game. We've played it through thick and thin (4th edition...) or come back thanks to an improvement game balance (5th edition) and don't want to leave. We will though sooner or later if you keep piling on idiotic choices on us. Other companies like Privateer Press did very well in the early to mid-2000s for a reason and people will migrate to other gaming systems if you continue to mistreat them and their loyalty.
As it stands I question why you do the things you do. Raising prices every year annoys me but I cannot complain too loudly as your products are a luxury item but you do not provide excellent customer service one usually expects with such goods. I certainly find minimal fault with your staff or when your product is damaged/faulty but your overarching business model seems counter-intuitive to maintaining a customer base. Even if you are getting a large amount of new customers imagine how much better off your company would be if you had maintained a significant portion of your repeat customers. The model you are running currently to me does not seem sustainable as your turnover rate in customers is just too high. I applaud your efforts in making 40k 5th edition a more competitive game but what you've done to Fantasy 8th edition doesn't bode well for the future.
Please, look to satisfy both the shareholders and the customer rather than just the former.
Kirby.
P.S. Anyone who agrees with this, I would greatly appreciate this being re-posted on your blog so we might actually garner GW's attention and hopefully move forward together. That is the ultimate goal, I want Games Workshop to succeed as a company so I can continue to enjoy the gaming systems I do but to do that, Games Workshop must look at altering their business model in the long run to maintain a steady customer base.
P.P.S. keep it civil in the comments kids and don't bitch, discuss.
SneakyDan · 723 weeks ago
Only a company intent on financial suicide would keep ignoring it. One voice can be brushed off as a disgruntled player, thousands mean a disgruntled consumer base. Something must be done. Send in polite, well written emails outlining your dissapointment, the more of us that do, the better chance we have.
Warboss Stalin · 723 weeks ago
Dezzo · 723 weeks ago
Keep that up for ONE FULL YEAR and they will get the message.
But unfortunately, a good majority of GW customers whine and complain but eventually go back to buying their products.
Want to have a voice? Stand together and stop buying GW products. They will lose out more than you in the end and be forced to change their ways.
fester40k 73p · 723 weeks ago
My blog repost. Letter to be written.
Comrade · 723 weeks ago
I mean, could you blame someone from the wonderful land of Aus from purchasing gear from England? My last purchase was a 10 man space marine squad, a Templar upgrade kit and 3 baal predators for a little under two hundred dollars. The same purchase from an Australian store would have cost me well over three hundred dollars.
And its not just we wargamers who get hurt. What about Maelstrom? What about Wayland? What do they gain out of all this? Those dedicated few of us, as Kirby said, who have friends across the pond will still buy their gear from Maelstrom (Of whom I emailed earlier to ask if my money was still good there interms of 40k purchases). Sure the savings wont be as great, but it'll still be a hell of alot cheaper then buying local.
Angelust · 723 weeks ago
1) Don't begin with "Why?" It might sound clever on the internet, but it feels very unprofessional.
2) Use your first paragraph to state the intent of the letter and preview your coming points, as well as grab their attention. "Hello, I'm Kirby, and I've been an active proponent of your game systems and a hobby enthusiast for x years. I've loved the game and its iterations, but recently I'm about to give up the hobby and encourage my associates to do the same. In the following letter I will describe what has caused me and my friends so much dissatisfaction from Games Workshop recently, and will offer x# suggestions on how we believe Games Workshop can revive the existing hobby community while simultaneously increasing their business development in the following season." -- I dunno, something to that effect so that the reader doesn't just dump it as venting gamer-rage. As mentioned, a few hundred of these sent to the same department will likely get mentioned in a meeting higher up as a meeting item.
3) I would suggest lightening the tone of the letter to be more civil, and make it sound more mutually beneficial (though you reached this a bit toward the end). They're most likely not going to care too much if there are a bunch of pissed off Australians unless they can link it to a direct loss of sales/profit/viability.
4) Shorten the letter significantly. A single pager with space for heading and signature and all is ideal. If staff need to read a stapled paper filled with complaints, they're going to skim it and disregard it.
5) Focus on your response as a customer. They already have professional financial analysts and business majors working for them, they have no idea if you're even remotely qualified to discuss business strategy. If it were me, I'd ignore every bit of marketing advice you gave, and if I were a higher up with a degree or two in the field, I'd dismiss the letter as insulting. Your greatest credibility is your role as consumer, and as a promoter of the hobby. Mentioning that you host a famous WH40k blog with xxx,xxx hits per month is more likely to interest them as you're more apt to gauge public opinion than they are. I would press this point in my letter.
I think writing letters like this is a great idea. I don't want to see GW crumble either, as I enjoy the game and would hate to see it go the way of Confrontation. I hope 3++ can lead the way for other blogs in this manner.
Mexican · 723 weeks ago
Lyracian 59p · 723 weeks ago
Also I do not mind being a middleman, and once a year forwarding a package from UK to Oz if they do not change their mind. (so long as someone pays me for the shipping)
MarshalLaeroth 52p · 723 weeks ago
TheGayCommissar · 723 weeks ago
I hope if enough people speak up they won't go ahead with this change. It are making Commissar sadest :(
Feed up guy..... · 723 weeks ago
hotpanda · 723 weeks ago
Dalinair · 723 weeks ago
jon paul adams · 723 weeks ago
soulquake1 36p · 723 weeks ago
Interestingly enough I wonder whether GW will, having noticed the outcry over this latest range of price increases, along with the tightening of their resale policy, and actually make any response.
I would like to encourage GW to respond via medium of Facebook/Blog Post and clarify as to why they are not fixing the exchange rate differentials, the resale policy tightening, and the increased cost of the Resin models. I am sure that if GW were to communicate their policies and decisions in a manner that was clear and concise, we the customer would maybe not agree, but would have a greater understanding of their motives/decisions.
Furthermore, I sincerely hope that this price increase is not merely a justification to allow the shareholders greater divideds, but an actual revenue generating measure that will allow them to invest in quicker FAQ's, Errata's, Quicker range updates (Codex/Models), for if this is their intention then I will continue to support them.
I understand GW is a business, setup to make profits, and increase shareholder value, but in doing so I would appreciate how GW's Board and executive management are ignoring their competitors, and the current economic climate, and its implications for the aforementioned.
Lastly, thank you GW for your continuing production of fantastic models. Please continue to do so, but be aware that sea-change has occured and no longer will the consumer idly accept any changes, increases without considering the competitors.
TheWolfsLunch 61p · 723 weeks ago
Thank you GW, you have destroyed my entire gaming group aswell, and we were doing so well.
Ben · 723 weeks ago
@Kaireis · 723 weeks ago
I know I like 8th Ed. much more than 6th or 7th. And I play Brets - a lackluster army in 8th rules.
Good letter otherwise, but should trim for brevity.
Fofr · 723 weeks ago
Katie Drake · 723 weeks ago
Post there and sound angry.
Karvala · 723 weeks ago
Loken 29p · 723 weeks ago
Grovel 61p · 723 weeks ago
*Magic is retarded in 8th, but overall balance is actually very good and the game itself has fewer exploitable rules (hi steadfast) than it has in previous editions. If certain spells were toned down a bit the game would be fantastic.
Prometheus 101p · 723 weeks ago
Raptors8th · 723 weeks ago
Demitra · 723 weeks ago
SandWyrm · 723 weeks ago
@Raptors8th
As a 40K player who used to play Fantasy in the 90's, my understanding is that GW attempted to address the game's extreme army book imbalance by introducing more randomness into the base system.
Problem being, randomness (past a certain point) is not what you want when playing competitively. Player skill doesn't matter much in Sorry or Candyland, for instance.
And those balance problems still exist.
The things I hear about certain spells taking out 2/3rds of an army on the first turn and the reliance on huge blocks of troops deployed in weird system-gaming formations doesn't make me want to blow the dust off of my Dwarves either. Not to mention that a Fantasy army will typically cost much more than a 40K army due to the number of troops involved.
Jake Bussey · 723 weeks ago
http://ifitwearspowerarmor.blogspot.com/2011/05/o...
silvio · 723 weeks ago
We are looking for alternatives and yes, I tottally agree with this open letter to GW and too bad they decided togo this way
Gotthammer · 723 weeks ago
"Thanks for your enquiry.
We charge a price we believe is appropriate for the products we sell. Each year we review our prices to ensure we continue to charge what is appropriate. We may raise prices on some products at this time and this can be done to increase revenue, however is more commonly done to offset inflationary pressures such as rising staff costs, rising freight costs and the like.
Thus, each year we don’t necessarily raise prices on all products, only those we determine are needed."
No answer from the UK.
Anyone else going to Games Day? The Q&A panel should be fun ;)
Bob · 723 weeks ago
-Lack of support for less popular armies (Part of the fun for me is facing off against many different armies. If Games Workshop wants this game to be Marines against Marines, I don't mind. But stop pretending Xenos have a place in it).
-Senseless price increase every year.
As long as both these problems are not resolved, I will stay a PP player only. Not that I don't like GW's models. It's just that out of principle I refuse to buy GW made stuff until they change their policies. And I'm sticking to it, no mater what! If you really feel so strongly about this, do the same. And don't just stop buying for a year. Stop forever. Ether drag them into bankruptcy (where someone else more sensible will buy them back) or stop complaining. Buying is voting. Vote for the kind of GW you want today!
Volcatus · 723 weeks ago
Games Workshop Customer Services
6211 East Holmes Road
Memphis
TN, 38141
USA
Devjon · 723 weeks ago
Secondly, people have said to email, others have said to send actual letters. I'm doing both. And I'm calling. I want my voice to be heard and I encourage everyone else to do the same. We don't need to all do it at the same time, that might break something, we just need a bulk of letters, emails, calls, faxes, anything you can think of.
But, again, GW can ignore the complaints but they cannot ignore the loss in prices.
shawn · 723 weeks ago
@TheCodexProject · 723 weeks ago
I had already taken note how much less I had spent with GW last year when I did my taxes this year. So far this year the amount is heading toward half of last years totals. Mostly because the prices are too high and the quality of their products continue to fall. This price increase will stop my spending dead.
I had planned to finnish building a new Grey Knights army and after seeing the new DE releases I was going to buy a DE army. I canceled those orders this morning. I am done. I will spend time making my terrain better. Painting what I have to a higher standard. Doing more conversion before I paint etc...
Sending letters to GW will do absolutely nothing. This is a company that is so out of touch with reality and good business practices it no longer matters. At this point my hopes are that he company who picks up the various divisions of GW when they go out of business will be an enlightened one.
If you want to get GW's attention do not send them letters and emails, go to the London Stock Exchange, find out who their largest institutional investors are and send letters to them. GW will not pay attention to what we say to them but they will pay attention to the giant firms who hold most of their stock when they contact them concerned that they are getting letteres from their customers saying they will no longer buy GW products
Jeff
C'nor · 723 weeks ago
Also, some people had asked for a form for letters/emails so that they don't have to take the (not inconsiderable) time to make one for themselves. How about something like:
(Opener of your choice)
I have been a regular player and purchaser of your games, and the attendant models for (insert time)/*have been considering getting into your games recently*/. However, I will stop purchasing anything produced by you, or that you otherwise profit from/*will not do so and will refuse to buy anything that you will profit from in any way*/ until you lift your embargo on UK suppliers shipping to countries outside of the EU and other parts of Europe, and price products in Australia in a reasonable manner.
(Signature)
Alex · 723 weeks ago
Because a little increase and you have to shop at a discount store. That's fine, not everyone is made of money. Think about your FLGS or the GW store that you usually visit and play your games at: Just buy your products from them as a courtesy tipping them for opening a store for you guys to gather for your games. That's a simple concept, why is it so hard to understand? You guys don't like tipping people?
You play world of warcraft or any kind of online games that you need to pay a monthly fee? Ask yourself where that fee goes.
If you have something good, you never sell it for cheap. I know someone is going to bring up PP's game is good and cheap. I will save your trouble to make yourself look dumb in the eye of marketing. When you started a somewhat new system (I'm aware of when they first came out) and still trying to gather more buyers, you can't expand and increase like GW. Only until you have more buyers and players, and then hit them with larger size army requirement.
Rants out
someoneelsetookdude · 723 weeks ago
Joe · 723 weeks ago
Kirby 118p · 723 weeks ago
1) Thank you for the positive response.
2) I completely agree this isn't the 'hyper professional' type of letter everyone needs to send into Games Workshop. I am however, aboard the idea of doing so and would love if a couple of people could e-mail and we could work together on an appropriate letter which we can have everyone post together.
I don't really feel this will do anything but you never know, it might. At the same time I am not purchasing any more Games Workshop products. I have what I need for my armies (though no Dark Eldar *sad*) and will wait for them to change their policy or someone snaps up their IP.
Vote with your wallets!
Kirby 118p · 723 weeks ago
This isn't a complaint about the price rises. They happen and whilst I think the Games Workshop product is currently way over-costed (add in notes about how you used to get boxes of 16-20 guys and now it's boxes of 10 guys, etc.) but it is a luxury item. We could go on and on about inflation and how Games Workshop is marking their product up over the inflation rate, regularly, without regards to the economic situation but that's what I'd rather avoid. This is particularly aimed at point out the terrible decision they are making in trying to gain more money based off of a poor international business model for re-pricing their goods and attempting to force Australians and others, to buy their product at an even inflated price.
There are much better ways to encourage this type of activity from individuals in these countries rather than banning independents selling overseas (and it looks like Wayland is attempting to find the legal ruling on this which IMO, is great).
In regards to 8th Fantasy.
It's way better than it used to be but there are still some major issues that have been covered here and I'll just quickly glance over them.
1) Randomness. Some random is good but having so much? Less so. Terrain, charge, magic, etc. all lead to a game with a lot of luck involved and consistently bad dice rolls leave you nearly no hope of having a come back.
2) Magic. If you army cannot do magic or deal with magic well, pack up and go home. If you nuke your opponents spell-caster first, you generally win. Major imbalance there even if everything else has been greatly improved.
3) Missions. They are really rather meh and whilst I have no prior experience with Fantasy missions, have heard the same from more 'competitive' minded Fantasy players.
To me, 8th edition is both a great step forward and huge leap backwards. The rule set seems much more refined and overall more balanced (assuming all the army books are brought into line re point values). The new books don't seem as flash (Orcs & Goblins) but aren't utter tripe either. Ultimately I think they missed that little bit in what has made 40k 5th edition so successful which has translated to quite a significant divergence in like/dislike for the two.
Jason · 723 weeks ago
For example. New Zealand versus the UK.
Grey Knights in power armour, £20.50
Current exchange rate, $2.08 to the £1
Converted price, $42.64
Actual price, $64.40
Total increase, 51%
Commander Dante (a model that paid for its sculpting decades ago)
England £10.25
Converted $21.32
New Zealand $32.70
Total increase 53%
That's with VAT on the English product, at 20% it's more than the 15% GST that we pay here.
The cost of shipping would probably be absorbed in the difference between each nations VAT. With only 10% that would apply doubly to Australia.
From here New Zealand and the United Kingdom seem to have a similar average wage (with Australia being much higher). It's not as if we're earning 50% more than the UK so can afford to pay 50% more.
All I can say is, bad show GW. Bad show!
Bane · 723 weeks ago
Krisken · 723 weeks ago
Dezzo · 723 weeks ago
necroninja 36p · 723 weeks ago
Warhammer, Video games,
Is there anything that DOSEN'T cost twice as much in australia?
14lancelot 6p · 723 weeks ago
What is really fun is that today I found an interesting chinese website you may want to check out: http://www.miniatureshobby.com/index.php?main_pag...
Now I'll wait and see if somebody purchases from them and I can see some review.
JTT · 723 weeks ago
VT2 79p · 723 weeks ago
That way, GW gets no money.
Rob · 663 weeks ago
http://ozhammer.webs.com provides a limited number of stock items at UK RRP for Australia and New Zealand.
Postage is calculated on what it costs us. Typical battle force postage is £15 for 5 day delivery. Even less if you can wait and we send it by sea.
alexathomson1795 2p · 270 weeks ago