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Sunday, September 2, 2012

Back from ATC & results

Just got in from ATC! NOVA is in full swing I see... anyway. 5th edition is finally out of the way so here's how it unfolded...

1st - New Zealand (boo hiss)
2nd - New South Wales (go team)
3rd - Victoria (go Crynn's team)
4th - Western Australia (go Matt's team)
5th - Queensland
6th - South Australia
7th - Australian Capital Territory
8th - Tasmania

NZ thumped the competition with their only loss coming final round (when they had already won) against Western Australia and looked to get tough match-ups to...test their skills? I.e. gloat. Bloody kiwis! 3rd/4th were once again seperated by a single Battle Point and last year's top two teams slipped to 5th/6th, so some good competition overall.

Time was an issue across the board for all teams - Turn 5 was being rushed for most games as the match-up process took too long (not enough alloted time). Most games were being played in under two hours and this led to some issues here and there for many teams. Need to work on that as a community for next time (and the answer is not the insane three hours the ETC allows). Terrain was fairly decent across the board as well which was nice and it was a good atmosphere with the chance to meet up with people I don't run into regularly around the local scene. And I got to plug 3++con :P.

Team-wise was a lot better as we actually had some pre-tournament work done on match-ups and were able to minimise the number of crappy games we had. Less group think! This shows with the improved result so good job team NSW! We ended up three wins (QLD, ACT, TAS), two draws (SA, WA) and one loss (NZ).

Anyway, individually didn't drop a game again though had two draws. First game against Dark Eldar (SA) didn't get a Turn 5 and my opponent only had two Venoms + Ravager left versus most of my army. Might not have killed them obviously but would have liked Turn 5 at least... Either way, team got a win which was the important bit. Then win against Necrons (QLD). Win against Dark Eldar again (NZ). The other controversial draw against Tyranids (WA) where the TO said you do not measure 3" up from the objective despite my opponent and I having played that the entire game. This did change the result from a Team Win to Team Draw but it didn't affect the final standings so again, no biggie. Final two games were wins against Dark Eldar (TAS) and Space Wolves (ACT).

I'll put up more detailed analysis of the games later but I didn't do battle reports sorry. Old edition at this point and most games were being pressed for time where those couple minutes for photos made a difference.

All up - great fun again and nice to do something different with a team focus.

And yes. Well done Kiwis.

Comments (34)

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"Terrain was fairly decent across the board" Oh Kirby, you punny, punny man
2 replies · active 661 weeks ago
;)

Better than last year's and there was generally 25% coverage - just LoS blocking was sometimes...lacking. Or sometimes...over the top :P.
Par for the course, then.
I'm curious how a Warmachine-style "Deathclock" would work in 40k? In other words, each player receives a specific amount of time and as they take their turn their time would run down. If they ran out of time then their turn would end immediately and take no more actions. Maybe each player gets 75 minutes?

I know it'd be controversial for certain armies but no matter what you do for timing it will be controversial.
3 replies · active 661 weeks ago
The problem is in 40K there's a decent number of things you do on the other guy's turn (rolling saves and close combat spring to mind.) It would be very easy to wreck the other guy's clock by using those to your advantage.

Also, 1:30 per game is... pretty short for anything except maybe 1500pts, and even there 6E has slowed things down a lot with the new wound allocation, etc.
Guesticular's avatar

Guesticular · 661 weeks ago

An hour is 60 minutes, not 100 minutes. So it would be 2:30 per game.
Every time you mention the deathclock "Duncan Hills coffee Jingle" starts playing in my head.
Using Guard for NSW - 3 wins, 2 draws, 1 loss. Scored 18/2 vs SA Ork foot spam, 2/18 vs Qld Grey Knight Purifier/Purgations in KP, 11/9 vs Blood Angels NZ, 10/10 vs Necrons WA, 17/3 vs Ork Ghaz/Battlewagons, and 19/1 vs Mech BA.

The BA draw vs NZ was mainly due to lack of time available I think (4 turns) which pushed my troops into a bad spot. The Necrons WA was a ref called obj contest, with both armies pretty totaled, if he hadn't contested it would be 15-5 my way. And the GK just raped my mech lol.
Killswitch's avatar

Killswitch · 661 weeks ago

ETC uses 3 and a half hours, you need that kind of time to play highly competitive games & setup match ups!
1 reply · active 661 weeks ago
3 hours for a game is insane. That's how long a teaching game should take. Or when playing Vince.

Half hour for match-ups is probably needed though, I think we had 15 mins and most teams used 20-30 mins which took the 2.15 hours down to 2ish.
What exactly did you mean about the measuring 3 inches up from the objective? Was it in a ruins and there were guys that were trying to claim it from a higher floor, or is it something else?
8 replies · active 661 weeks ago
The objective, according to the TO, was only measured laterally, never vertically. So despite Scouts being in a floor around 3" above the objective, you couldn't measure up.
No, the TO said you could measure up, and it was 3 inches from the objective with the objective being 15mm high. If the obj is 15mm high, and you have to be within 3 inches, then it is 3 inches 15mm that you can measure to.
The problem was the objective wasn't exactly under the ledge, and the ledge was slightly more than 3 inches high.

Kirby and his opponent were both playing as inf high objectives, and kirby (if he had realised) obviously could have shifted his scouts last turn for a win. But what can you do :) Didn't change placings at all.
Well t hat's what I was told ^^.

The objective was under the ledge at original placement but as Matt said, it had been poked and prodded by so many people it couldn't be determined. In the end didn't matter as we still got 2nd thankfully.

But ya, the annoying factor is...there was no reason the Scouts weren't holding the objective. Whilst I was all over his :P lol.
We were playing that objectives were only 15mm high. It was new to a lot of players (including me) and a bit counter-intuitive, and I had tried to get it changed to the "infinite cylinder" before the tournament since it's not cinematic if beasts can't score and contest an objective up a tree and doesn't forge a narrative if bikers can't screech up to grab an objective in a building.

There were a few other odd FAQ items that I don't even care enough about 5th edition to even mention, but the organisers did such a good job with this event I don't want to nitpick on the details - the good outweighed the bad to such an extent and everyone from our team wants to try get in to the 2013 ATC.
Agreed. And in the end, I don't think the results were impacted at all (i.e. it affected your game and my game thus cancelling it out).
But see, how wide are the objectives? However big they were.. usually 25mm etc. And then where do you measure from? From the edge. And how far? 3 inches.

The faq was the objective is yay long/wide, and 15mm high. But that is the dimension of the obj. And you have to be within 3inch of the obj.. so you can be 3 inch 15mm from the ground point.
I think infinitely high objectors are completely stupid. There is no reason that bikes should be able to contest an objective which is high up in a building.
Me and the boys dropped in for a look, got to say alot of fantastically painted armies, but on the downside a few douchebags in the mix, seem to have big fish small pond syndrome... Gotta to say a massive thumbs up to the New Zealanders, they were really quite nice (excellent shirts), aswell as the 2 ork players, absolute legends
9 replies · active 661 weeks ago
Was there an obnoxiously bright blue one =D?
Obnoxiously blue what good sir? I was thinking of trying to hunt you down, but It'd be a bit stalker-esque.. haha
My army ^^.

People did that anyway lol.
AH well maybe I should of haha. What was your army, we had a pretty thorough stickybeak during your lunch break..
On Day 2?

Bright Blue Marines - the right most table closest to the stage (so Table 1). Was up against Nids.
The bright blue ones with pink mixed in?
Magenta...

But yes!
Sorry Magenta, they looked quite pimp mate. You didn't have to attack bikes and try explaining them as "Mephiston" to a couple of guys did you?...
That was me, yes ^^. Against Pat's crons.

And ta.
3.5 hours per game (plus 30 mins for matchups) is actually awesome, it almost completely removes any possibility of stalling and means you can afford the time to bring in a judge for a ruling if needed. There was also a slight language barrier to deal with in some instances, and it was 1850 as opposed to 1750. Even then I had 3 games use the entire period (not get called at time, we were able to roll for continuing turns and in two cases it went to 7).

Againt Christian in the last round, I knew I had to be on a taxi to the airport at 5:30, so we were paying extreme attention to time and both playing at a rate faster than either of us were really comfortable with, and then time got called half an hour early - 1hr 45 minutes total to play, that's crap. We actually did finish the full game as the dice said it ended turn 5, but we wouldn't have had time to take a 6th. Christian made a critical error in his last turn becuase of the rush, which could have turned it into a win for Vic and thus second on overall standings. (Oh, and Christian, I'm not talking about forgetting to shoot the Scouts! :p )
4 replies · active 661 weeks ago
If that happens, you need to stay on site for venue and likely push it to three days. Something which is harder to get by people (the latter at least) as that's no weekend with family and a day off work.

By Game 3 most of us had already realised timing was an issue and I was saying every game let's make sure we play quickly so we can get full games in. Part of the beast but I think if we had stayed on venue getting in 30 min match-ups and 2.5 hours for games would have been very easy and reduced a lot of the stress load. If you have 3.5 hours there's going to be a lot of twiddling thumb time for a lot of people who finish games in 2 hours. Which should be most of us.
If people would accept it, I think 3 days/2 games a day isn't a bad idea. I mean, if I'm traveling somewhere (and it is costing me to travel) then I'd rather spend more days than less, and make the most of it.
It's not so much "twiddling thumbs time" - it's "catch up with friends from all over the country/world time"!
Um McGowan and I chest bumped mid air about 30 times. There's only so much of this I can do.

*rubs chest*

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