Email in: Thunnnnnnderbubble!!!!

Saturday, November 13, 2010

Email in: Thunnnnnnderbubble!!!!

Posted by Unknown

"So, I've talked to you a couple of times and read the blog pretty extensively. I just started shying away from mono-build BT (which I still play, btw) but your Thunderbubble article intrigued me, and seems to fit decently well with the idea of using Vulkan. I've build up a list today, and I would like to get some feedback on it. Here we go.

1 Forgefather Vulkan He'stan (HQ) @ 190 Pts

1 Space Marine Librarian (HQ) @ 140 Pts
#Psychic Hood; #Terminator Armour; Null Zone; The Avenger; Terminator
Armour; Force Weapon; Storm Shield; Psyker

10 Terminator Assault Squad (Elites) @ 400 Pts
Combat Squads; Includes Terminator Sergeant; Thunder Hm. & Storm Sh. (x10)

9 Tactical Squad (Troops) @ 225 Pts
Combat Squads; Bolt Pistol (x9); Bolter (x7); Multi-Melta (x1); Meltagun (x1)
1 Space Marine Sergeant @ [36] Pts
Combi-Flamer (x1)
1 Rhino @ [40] Pts
#Searchlight; #Smoke Launchers; Dozer Blade; Repair; Storm Bolter
9 Tactical Squad (Troops) @ 220 Pts
Combat Squads; Bolt Pistol (x9); Bolter (x7); Multi-Melta (x1); Meltagun (x1)
1 Space Marine Sergeant @ [36] Pts
Frag Grenades; Krak Grenades; Combi-Flamer (x1)
1 Rhino @ [35] Pts
#Searchlight; #Smoke Launchers; Repair; Storm Bolter

1 Dreadnought (Elites) @ 125 Pts
TL Autocannon; TL Autocannon
1 Dreadnought (Elites) @ 125 Pts
TL Autocannon; TL Autocannon

1 Predator (Heavy Support) @ 85 Pts
2 Spons. Hvy Bolters; Turret Autocannon
1 Predator (Heavy Support) @ 85 Pts
2 Spons. Hvy Bolters; Turret Autocannon
1 Predator (Heavy Support) @ 85 Pts
2 Spons. Hvy Bolters; Turret Autocannon

Land Speeder Squadron (Fast Attack) @ 130 Pts
1 Land Speeder Tornado #1 @ [70] Pts
Multi-Melta; Heavy Flamer
1 Land Speeder Tornado @ [60] Pts
Heavy Flamer; Heavy Flamer

Land Speeder Squadron (Fast Attack) @ 130 Pts
1 Land Speeder Tornado #1 @ [70] Pts
Multi-Melta; Heavy Flamer
1 Land Speeder Tornado @ [60] Pts
Heavy Flamer; Heavy Flamer

Land Speeder Squadron (Fast Attack) @ 60 Pts
1 Land Speeder Tornado @ [60] Pts
Heavy Flamer; Heavy Flamer

Models in Army: 44 Total Army Cost: 2000

I have played it twice, and both times it has been solid. Against an assault or jump/drop army I deploy like a little wagon train, backed up onto an objective or something. I keep my fire lanes open and just dakka things from afar until they get within melta range, trusting in my thunderbubble to make any assaults think twice about getting anywhere near my firebase. Against a shooty army like Tau I combat-squad my termies and rush mid-field, where I splinter off to snatch objectives/kill points as needed. The reliable Vulkan thunderhammers have been very killy, and all of the speeder spam and Pred/Dread dakka seems to keep everything nice and shaken or slagged.

Any thoughts? Love your articles, and keep up the good work.

-Matt"

The HF/HF Speeders are pretty meh. Great for dropping hits onto them compared to the MM/HF speeders but finding the 30 points to upgrade them would be very much worth it. I'd drop the meltaguns on the tac squads to flamers and drop the combi-flamers which gets you the required points. Then upgrade all speeders to MMHF and you've got a good Vulkan Thunderbubble list.

Comments (16)

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0 Vote up Vote down

Kris · 751 weeks ago

Librarian should also probably have Gate of Infinity rather than Avenger, to help those Termies move around.

2 replies · active 751 weeks ago

+2 Vote up Vote down

sirbiscuit 81p · 751 weeks ago

Seconded. The terminators need to be able to go on the offensive quickly, in case your enemy can outrun and gun you.

0 Vote up Vote down

Matt · 751 weeks ago

Just fixed list, Dropped the Combi-flamer on both squad and the Meltagun down to a flamer on one squad, in addition to dropping dozer blades the points are now there (Thx Kirby, totally missed that clerical error.)

Gate- I just played a startlingly tight game against a Khan/Vulkan biker list. I would have won turn five, but it went to six. My termies had just decimated the Khan/Bikers squad alive in one round of combat, but they couldn't get to the other side of the board in time! Luckily that turn I dakka'd him completely off of the table with the Preds and Dreads. PHEW! Gate still would have come in very handy there! Ganna put it in!

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Matt · 751 weeks ago

The HF/HF speeders were a typo; those are HF/MM, haha. Used this list against GWvsJohn, and he said I had a pretty hard list. :) YAY! My first real codex marine list, and it passes through the Kirby test of dooooom!!! *cue the scary music*

@kris- I'm kindof up in the air about Gate. The termies can already deepstrike in if I need them to, so why deploy them and then deep strike them later, only in a riskier way (with gate)? Is there some advantage I am missing?

1 reply · active 751 weeks ago

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Kris · 751 weeks ago

Avenger on a foot Librarian in termi armor will very nearly never be used. Gate can allow you to redeploy quickly if you need to - if facing another fast army like Eldar/Dark Eldar. If you have last turn, it's a threat to contest/capture objectives. Yes, bad things can happen, but it's still viable to give otherwise slow Terminators some mobility.

0 Vote up Vote down

Kuolema · 751 weeks ago

If this is the same guy as I think it is then he has already heard my thoughts in chat box but I'll repeat them here anyway.

Long range fire power is;
4 twin-linked auto-cannons
3 auto-cannons
6 heavy bolters
Then with the pink ones suggestions you have 5 mobile twin-linked multi-meltas and two not so mobile ones.
In a 2000 point list I'm not exactly impressed. =/

I don't see the point of running vulcan and a libby in this list, I don't even see the point of running vulcan.
You have 730 points used up for your bubble wrap that don't offer more than hammer to face and stand around looking scary(+vulcans chapter trait).

I understand the theory behind using TH/SS termies as bubble wrap but wouldn't it make more sense to make a more long range focused list? So you can force your opponent to come to you rather than foot slog the termies towards your opponent when you come up against a shooty list?

7 replies · active 751 weeks ago

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Kirby 118p · 751 weeks ago

In this type of list (compared to the original thunderbubble) the Terminators are more offensive. They should be running at the opponent and the autocannons are there basically to open transports and the melta weapons to defend against heavy tanks. Yes you can replace the Tacs w/LasPlas squads but you'd have to fiddle (drop a Speeder) to get three in, which is of course viable but it comes down to wanting to use Vulkan. He makes the list a lot scarier up close so you need to emphasis that (otherwise why take him and just go with the normal thunderbubble) whilst still supporting the list at range if possible because you're using a bunch of terminators.

0 Vote up Vote down

Kuolema · 751 weeks ago

Because competitive 5th edition armies are suddenly scarred of foot termies now?

I don't see how it's up to the same level as other 5th edition competitive armies, I understand your original thunder bubble idea but using vulcan in a thunder bubble? Just not seeing it.

Yeah he makes your termies TH master crafted, but your termies actually have to catch something for that to matter and even then your two 5 man squads are bashing one squad each a turn, tops. You have done enough articles on blocking and bubblewraps to know getting your TH/SS on foot into combat with anything important is going to be hard.

+1 Vote up Vote down

Kirby 118p · 751 weeks ago

They certainly aren't scary by themselves and are just as scary without Vulkan but they are huge elephant in the room and whilst your ranged firepower isn't fantastic, it's still significant enough to suppress a decent proportion of the opponent's army.

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Kuolema · 751 weeks ago

And what happens when you run into an army that can suppress most of your own fire power?

Then you need your termies that move 7-12'' a turn to get to something important and smash it, also if your ranged elements are suppressing your opponent/being suppressed then what is dealing with your opponents bubble wrap? Be such a waste to walk all the way across the table just to bash IG platoons/kroot/gun drones/flat out cheap vehicles/cheap transports/ all the other forms of slowing a rock unit down you probably know better than I do.

They might be a huge elephant in the room but it's not hard to just throw them a few peanuts to keep them occupied. =]

+1 Vote up Vote down

Kirby 118p · 751 weeks ago

Agreed and that's the problem with a Hybrid list like this. Even if you replace Vulkan and look at the original Thunderbubble list, the preds are ACLC and the Tacs split down into LasPlas so the net gain really in terms of saturation is 2 LasPlas RBacks. if your opponent is capable of supressing the Preds, they still are when they are ACLC and the only difference is there's an extra two heavy weapons from the LasPlas coming at you.

The trade-off is obvioulsy Vulkan makes the aspects of the army such as the MM, flamers and Termies that much better. Is it worth it? Yes and no.

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Matt · 751 weeks ago

But you see, you can split off your attack into two squads, or two squads of termies and two IC's, depending on what is around. You are going to get the chance to smash *something* when you get there. I don't want to go with a LRC, because once you buy one you have to buy two, and then you don't have any points for anything else in the list. I'm thinking about adding a squad of scouts to infiltrate up, with a homing beacon on them. They'd have to survive, though, and that seems kindof a long shot.

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Kuolema · 751 weeks ago

Yes I know you combat squad them but they are still foot termies and bubble wrap/tarpit bait when they FINALLY get to your opponents lines.

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MarshalLaeroth 52p · 751 weeks ago

Mono-build? Psh. Only mono-build if you don't want to play the other archetypes. :D

As for the list, other than the Librarian having Gate instead of Avenger as was already mentioned...there aren't any glaring issues that I can see.

1 reply · active 751 weeks ago

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Matt · 751 weeks ago

Templar's don't do Dakka nearly as well as the other armies; they are king of CC, especially CC termies, and they get slightly cheaper LRC's, which is always a bonus. They get FC and TH'ing terminators, LC rerolling hits and wounds at Str5 is pretty impressive, and they get vows. Everything else is done better by codex marines, not to mention everyone else.

As far as I can see, and I could be wrong, there is only one thing that the Templar do best- that's LRC's with termies inside.