Email in: Space Marine Mech Thunderbubble Hybrid

"Hi Kirby,

i discovered your blog fairly recently and have to say its fantastic to find a 40k resource that is updated so frequently with solid information and clealy thought out editorials. based on the information i've come up with the folllowing army list annd was hoping you could give it an evaluation. I'm going to be painting the army as howling griffons in their night world scheme as depicted in Imperial Armour 9. I havent been able to find much concrete fluff regarding them apart from an 'abundance of librarians' and a particularly good armoury. fotunately this all plays into the list i wanted to build.

Email in: 2000pt Dreadbubble

Fawcett Avenue Conscripts

"Hey Kirby,
I've been working on the dreadbubble list that we were talking about a while back, and a bit of working around to come up with something I'm relatively happy with, so here it is.

Master of the Forge - 190
- Conversion Beamer, Bike

Email in: List for review

Black Matt

"Dear Kirby,

I've been reading your blog for a few weeks now, and I think you are doing a great job at giving people feedback on their lists. Since I'm slowly building up my first 1750 pts army for 40k, I would really appreciate your insight on it. The past 6 months I've played a lot of different lists using my friends models as proxies. The last few weeks I've been sticking to the same models a lot, and I feel I found a list that I really like. The main thing this list builds around is the 10 man strong tactical terminator squad, joined by Lysander and Cassius. I like the flexibility of this squad, as it can hurt everything with its shooting and still pose a decent threat in melee. Another thing that I wouldn't like to see go is a 10 man scout snipers scout led by Telion. I like how this scoring unit can pose quite a long range threat. With bolster defences from lysander and the clustermines from the scout bikes, the snipers are a really tough unit to kill. This is my list thus far:

Email in: Want to Really Get Started, Looking for Help

Tale of Painters

"Hello Kirby,

I've Been Following my Husband to his Weekly Gambes Nights for a little under a year now and Have been Curious about trying to Start Playing the 40k Version, I ussually sit Reading a book or fall asleep resting my head on one of the unused Tables but I would like to try and get more Involved In it.

I have been getting the Main idea of Playing from a 300 Point 10 Week League going on right now that allows 1 Boss and 1 Troop Squad where 6 People go on a heavy Terrain Table to Capture Tokens with the HQ's, It's fun to watch sometimes especially with the Robots Lightning Guy or Tyranids spawning babies non stop.

Email in: A codex marine player on a budget

MWG

"Hello Kirb&co!

I've been playing 40k for a while now but mostly low point games (1000-1500) due to my small model collection. Now I'm trying to scale up to 1750 points but I need to plan very carefully because money is an issue. I'm thinking about running some sort of 'thunderbubble' list (the article seems to be down by the way), unfortunately I'm not able to run MSU, again because of money issues. SO with that being said lest's get to it, here's what I thought for a list (the units marked with an asterisk are the ones I actually own). Note that this is the end of my collection, as you can probably tell I'm building from the AOBR set (so there's a captain too). My aim is to get the best out of what I already have without having to spend too much on extra stuff.

Email in: Hi 40k comp army build

"Hi I heard from a friend you are pretty responsive to emails and from looking at your site I see lots of experience posted throughout. So that said it brings me to my questions, I need one of my armies to be competitive in 2000 and 2500 point areas as long as on a national level. I will learn the tactics but the army build needs to be as competitive as can be call it cookie cutter if you want but winning is winning in my book and thats where the fun is for me. I have 2 options with lots of routes in my eyes....

Comparison: Grey Knight Terminators & TH/SS in 'Thunderbubbles'

Earlier in the chatbawks we had a conversation going about how effective a GKT 'Thunderbubble' could be. Let's take a look at these two units within this construct then and see how it plays out. This post will focus on two things. The strengths, weaknesses and ultimate differences between GKT and TH/SS Terminators and how they interact and support with the army built around them. This latter part is important in determining the effectiveness of the list whilst the former is more of a comparison of units.

Email in: List critique request: Lysander-wrap

"Hi Kirby,

I have a small Imperial Fists army that I thoroughly enjoy using in friendly games. It is not very competitive on paper, so I don't often take it to tournaments. However, I've recently gotten the itch to design and play a Lysander Bubble-wrap list at this years 'ard Boyz, and local 'ard Boyz-prep 2500 point tourneys (though 1750-1850 is still the norm around my area). But before I buy new models, I want to get some quality feedback on the concept and list. With that in mind, I'd be grateful for your comments and critiques. So without further ado:

How much would you be buying? We can try to minimise this if possible. I'm not a huge Lysander fan. He's great to have in a shooty unit like Sternguard or Shootynators but then kicks butt in combat and handing out S10 attacks. Stubborn is so-so; I really prefer combat tactics as it gives your army that extra mobility, particularly when you've got a bubble-wrap protection. However, generating a 3+ cover area for Shootynators to sit in is always nice and makes them a very serious option outside of TH/SS. Issue here then is Black Templars do that sort of list very well now as well... Anyway, let's check your list.

Email in: C:SM Shooty Terminators Advice

"Hi Kirby. Congratulations for your blog. It is crammed with useful advice and articles. You and your collaborators have really taught me how to play this game to win and have fun. I had been lost before, not knowing what to do with my codex. 3++ is truly my light of the Astronomican.

Okay, I'm done with the buttlicking (thought I really meant it :P). Just so we are on the same page, I've thoroughly read VT2's series about Codex: Space Marines and the rest of the articles about them. I've tweaked my lists accordingly, but still there are some things that I cannot seem to grasp. One of them is shooty Terminators.

I can't find a way to properly run them. I've always put a 5 man squad on DS reserve, out of ignorance, with pretty bad results. Though I scarcely suffered DS mishaps, they never actually paid off.

I've got a Phobos Land Raider, so I thought "maybe this will work?". I ran it a couple of times, 5 Terminators in this LR with MM. I managed to drop a Tervigon and some Termagaunts once, only to find myself stuck in combat and overrun by even more Termagaunts 2 turns later.

Email in: a unique marine list i would really like some input on

 

I'm really behind on emails, there's just too many of them atm! I'm going to be doing a lot more replying back to the send which often won't have as much detail but I don't want 3++ to just become e-mails. They are a great filler and help with discussion at times but lately there's been more of these than significant articles. This will happen at times (i.e. when I don't have the time to write a fully fledged article which seems to be a lot lately lol) but I'd rather it not be the norm.

Anyway I'm posting this e-mail right now because it's a 'BoLS transfer' reader which I think is +1 for the 'BoLS experiment.' lol

"Hello,

I have just recently started reading your blog after it had been mentioned on BoLS and several podcasts and i have to say, this is now my FAVORITE 40k blog and i have been going through all your old articles. I think your Codex reviews are possibly the best ones i have read. (the Tyranid one being the best imho) They give very in depth and thought out opinions that make me reconsider some units i initially did not like.

Email in: Weird thunderbubble list

"Hi Kirby

Been reading your blog on and off for a couple of months now-interesting stuff, and I like the relatively relaxed feel to the site and contributors.

So I'm loving the Thunderbubble stuff, and I've been thinking about running a list based on the concept, but with some weirdness of my own.

1750 points

Glad you like the blog and Thunderbubble is a fun build combining the strengths of Mech SM and the awesomeness of TH/SS. The issue at 1750 becomes balancing your army and the number of Terminators. 10 is too many (but super scary) and 5 is too few to be effective.

1 Librarian, terminator armour, storm shield, Null Zone, Vortex of DOOOM!!! (140 pts)

8 TH/SS Terminators (320 pts) (5 seems too few and ten two many at 1750)
1 Dreadnought, twin linked autocannon x 2 (125 pts)
1 Dreadnought, twin linked autocannon x 1, plasma cannon x 1 (125
points) (why plasma? just a bit of variation really, I hate blood angels/any units with feel no pain/power armour, and i don't have plasma on the razorback turrets yet)

Can BT do a thunderbubble??

Here is the next list in a series of refreshed Templar lists here on 3++. Kirby has written a hybrid list, which I'll look at a bit later and I attempted a foot list too. I want to try to explore tried and tested concepts with the newly refreshed codex and see how we can compete. Today I would like to have a think about the concept of Kirby's Thunderbubble.

Kirby's 1750 list is almost a mech saturation list with some added terminators to block and tackle any burly units that may come your way. The dreads and preds throw out a good amount of firepower, supported by the Las/Plas razors. Trying to make a like-for-like list would be impossible as BT do not have access to dakka dreads or cheap razors. They do have so other options though... maybe even better??? We shall see.

What options do we have? Cheap as chips Land speeder typhoons will hopefully take the place of the dakka dreads. AutoLas preds (with a cheeky tricksiness) are a similar cost so are in and we'll have to make use of dreads too. The big differences come in the troops section really. The EC is a pain as he doesn't offer us psychic defence, but he does give the bubble more bite and the rest of the soft-stuff that little bit better. He's not a librarian, but he's different and can join the bubble for Ld10, crusader seals and more punch.

Email in: 1850 Thunderbubble

"Hello,
My name is Christian and I have recently started playing 40k and am making my plans to attend my first tournament in a couple months, and I need to get an army concept down so I can start painting and testing it beforehand. I really loved your Thunderbubble ideas and am trying to fit them into 1850 points, however the low number of Troops and low amounts of melta has me worried. Well, here is what I have so far.

Librarian
- Terminator Armour
- Gate of Infinity & Null Field

10 Assault Terminators
- Hammer and Shield

Email in: 1850 spacewolf list

"Hi Kirby & Co, I've been playing my Wolves for a while now and I've found many of your articles to be helpful, informative, and occasionally hilarious. My FLGS generally plays games and runs tournaments at 1850 and I've sort of settled into a rut as far as list-building goes. I've been doing pretty well W/L/D-wise, but I would like you to take a look at my list and tell me what I could improve about it.

One thing I'm not very keen on changing is the Heavy Support. I know it would probably be best to switch the vindicators for dakkapreds or more long fangs, but I like my vindys. Everything else is fair game! I have a lot of other models sitting around...

Email in: 1500 Space Marines

"Hi Kirby

Been reading 3++ for a little while now, mostly in an attempt to improve my game of 40k, and I figured I’d drop you a mail regarding my present list-based-problems. I’ve mostly been a Guard player and done reasonably well with them, though only in a local group of buddies sort of gaming environment for just now, and have now switched to playing around with Codex Space Marines. I’ve had limited success thus far, mostly getting my ass kicked using what I now realise is a pretty sub-par list that looked something sort of like this;

Captain, Relic Blade, Artificer Armour, some other toys

Tactical squad on foot, missile launcher, plasma gun
Tactical squad in Rhino, MM, flamer, combi-flamer, PF
Scout squad with bolters, HB, camo

Tactical Terminators, AssCan
Dred, AssCan, HF x2

Speeder Typhoon x2

Having done some reading, mostly on 3++ after having abandoned Dakka as largely worthless for tactical advice, I’ve put together a new, improved, hopefully less fail list that looks like this;

Email in: SM Bikers - Termies

"Hi kirby, well been working on a couple of SM list, and I wanted to ask you what you though about them, and If you see them competitive.

One is a clasic Bikers-termies mixed list, the other one, Vulkan list. here they go

Vulkan.
Captain, bike, StormShield, RelicBlade, fusion bombs.
HG, 3x LC, 4 SS, 2x melta guns, ThunderHammer

5 x Assault Termies, 4x TH/SS, 1x Lighting claws.

4x bikes, melta, flamer, PF
1x AB, MM
4x bikes, melta, flamer, PF
1x AB, MM
4x bikes, melta, flamer, PF
1x AB, MM
4x bikes, melta, flamer, PF
1x AB, MM

MotF List 1: Thunderbubble Dreads

I'll tell you the truth, google told me to do a post on this as it's been searched quite a bit in relation to 3++ lately. Thanks google <3. Based on our previous analysis of the Forgelord (Master of the Forge) we are going to be using him in a bunch of lists to show he can be used to make competitive lists that are different and similar to those before. The first one is a Thunderbubble divergence. Recalling Thunderbubble (BTW, thanks Ron from FTW for linking my How To!) it's essentially a long-ranged SM gunline built around protection from a Terminator bubble-wrap (i.e. big scary unit). The list utilises the defenses provided by the Terminators and multiple, long-ranged tank platforms to suppress and destroy the enemy. This same concept will be envisioned with Thunderbubble Dreads but with more Dreads.

So we obviously need to start off with a MotF and we come to one of the problems, where to put him? He's not too useful in a RBack unlike a Libby and he's not going to fit into a Rhino unless we forcibly combat squad a Tac squad which we don't want to be forced into. In Thunderbubble he can hang with the Terminators but without any option for an invul this could be problematic and we don't want him running around solo with a CB on a Bike even though it'd be awesome. A plain old bike would be nice to keep up with Mech and hide in a mech castle to repair a bunch of tanks but that's a pretty expensive use for him. So for the moment we'll just run him bare and presume he'll hang with Terminators or in an RBack. We need the Terminators too so 500 points gone (10x TH/SS).

Email in: Thunnnnnnderbubble!!!!

"So, I've talked to you a couple of times and read the blog pretty extensively. I just started shying away from mono-build BT (which I still play, btw) but your Thunderbubble article intrigued me, and seems to fit decently well with the idea of using Vulkan. I've build up a list today, and I would like to get some feedback on it. Here we go.

1 Forgefather Vulkan He'stan (HQ) @ 190 Pts

1 Space Marine Librarian (HQ) @ 140 Pts
#Psychic Hood; #Terminator Armour; Null Zone; The Avenger; Terminator
Armour; Force Weapon; Storm Shield; Psyker

10 Terminator Assault Squad (Elites) @ 400 Pts
Combat Squads; Includes Terminator Sergeant; Thunder Hm. & Storm Sh. (x10)

Mech Marine Centurion list change?

Was running through some scenarios through my head and just putting this on paper; lack of an anvil/anti-hammer/etc unit. This would obviously take the form of TH/SS Terminators but then be very akin to the Thunderbubble list which wasn't voted favorably. Would need to drop a Dreadnought obviously and a Speeder plus shave 5 points somewhere (which could be problematic) which drops two vehicles from the army and therefore makes it unlikely I can add combis/HKM if needed unless I drop two Speeders. However, it does give a rock hard assault unit which means I can be more aggressive and have some extra defenses against hammer units/MCs/Dreads/etc. Thoughts? or keep with pure Mech if I roll with this list?

The list would look something like:

Libby
2x Riflemen Dreads
5x TH/SS Terminators
2x10x Tacs w/flamer/MM/Rhino
2x5x Tacs w/LasPlas RBack
3xMM/HF Speeders
3x Dakka Preds

Email in: A 1750 Marine list for review

"Hey Kirby,

I read your reply and went back to the drawing board so to speak and have another idea for my Salamanders and thought maybe you'de like to give comments again. I've also had a read through your marine codex review's so that's where some of the idea's came from. That's VT2's! I'm not 100% sold on the dreads, but they can link up with the termie squad to help them in thier wrap around roll

HQ
Vulkan

ELITES
6 Assault Terminators
-6 Thunderhammer and Storm Shields