Kirb your enthusiasm!


"Pink isn't a color. It's a lifestyle." - Chumbalaya
"...generalship should be informing list building." - Sir Biscuit
"I buy models with my excess money" - Valkyrie whilst a waitress leans over him

Friday, November 19, 2010

Email in: Triple the 'Fex, Triple the Love.

Hi Kirby&Crew!

You have a nice blog and I really like the articles and the general atmosphere of it. Keep it up!

As I’m going to my first 40K tournament in January it was quite helpful and now I’m starting to put my army together and paint everything. (Also I clicked the banner and bought the stuff I still needed from Wayland. I hope that’s enough to pay the toll? ;) )

I think it works out well, even if it is pretty slow, but I could only test it 2 times against mediocre army lists.
(I could also test a version watered down to 1000P. twice, but I don’t think that really counts.)

So I’m still unsure of certain things, so I figured I could use some good feedback.
The tournament itself has no restrictions or comp.

Here is the list:

*************** 1 HQ ***************
Alphawarrior, Pair of Boneswords, Scything talons, Toxin sacs, Regeneration
- - - > 110 points

*************** 3 Elite ***************
3 Hive Guards
- - - > 150 points

3 Hive Guards
- - - > 150 points

1 Venomtrophe
- - - > 55 points

*************** 5 Standard ***************
12 Termaganten, Fleshborers
- - - > 60 points

10 Termaganten, Fleshborers
- - - > 50 points

Tervigon, Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs, Catalyst, Onslaught, Cluster Spines
- - - > 210 points

Tervigon, Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs, Catalyst, Onslaught, Cluster Spines
- - - > 210 points

4 Tyranid Warriors, Lash Whips and Boneswords, Scything Talons, 1 x Barbed Strangler, Toxin sacs
- - - > 210 points

*************** 3 Unterstützung ***************
Tyrannofex, Rupture Cannon, Cluster Spines, Desiccator Larvae
- - - > 265 points

Tyrannofex, Rupture Cannon, Cluster Spines, Desiccator Larvae
- - > 265 points

Tyrannofex, Rupture Cannon, Cluster Spines, Desiccator Larvae
- - - > 265 points

(I hope all the names are correct, as my codex is in a different language.)
Total points Tyranids : 2000

These two points here bug me the most:

-Venomthrophe: I like the benefits he gives me. 5+Cover save, defensive grenades and especially the dangerous terrain test, because it also means enemies will strike at Initiative 1. (If I read the rules correctly).
Unfortunately that means that my Hive Guard can only be deployed in 2x3 units. But 3x2 would be much better for destroying/suppress tanks.
Also he is pretty vulnerable to all kinds of enemy fire.

-Tyranid Warriors: I love these guys and I was always happy to have them to counter attack assault units, as I often felt that Termagants wouldn’t have been up to the task. (Like Sanguinary Guard +Dante+FnP)
In my last 1000P. game they singlehandedly carried the day against Space Wolves eating a unit of 4xTWC and two units of GH and held the objective I needed to win.
(Both my big bugs had already been chewed up by Jaws.)
So I guess my view of them is subjective. ;)
Still they are fragile if shoot at with the right weapons and that also means that the Alpha has to stick with them and the Venomthrophe has to walk alone.
So I thought about taking a Hive Tyrant+Guard instead, but as he has not as much damage output I don’t know if he is worth it.

Robin “Link-Hero-1”

Heya, Robin, glad to hear you like the site and glad to hear you're making us filthy rich off the link ads. ...Wait, I don't think I get any money from those. Wait, I don't think I get any money at all. I may need to talk to my agent.

In any case, your list looks pretty good. You are quite correct that 1K games are very, very different from 2K, so while they're certainly useful to get your skills up and try out units, they're no replacement for practicing with a list- which I strongly recommend.

You have a solid build overall, but a few little tweaks will, I think, really push it into the realm of being truly frightening. It isn't so much "slow" as it is "implacable"- there's really nothing you can throw in front of it that actually scares it, as it has tons of tools to deal with things, and it's 100% mobile; never forget that.

Some thoughts:

-I would normally recommend Whip on the HQ, but since he's going to be going with squads that already have them for the most part, you should be able to save those 5pts. You might consider leaving him with the Devourer instead of Talons, though- more there in a moment.

-Venomthropes are perfectly fine as a unit, however you are correct in being concerned at only running one at this large a points total. Currently I think giving up an Elites slot for a throwaway unit is a bad idea, but I think having Venomthropes is very workable idea. Let's see if we can add another one in somehow, which gives us a much better chance. You are also correct in your interpretation of the rules regarding the Vthrope and Dangerous Terrain reducing to I1 (unless the enemy has grenades, of course.) For some really hilarious moments, watch a mob of Orks charge your Termagants and lose six models in the process, before combat even starts. The way to take best advantage of them is to drop them right in behind your Tervis/T-Fexes, where they will get at least cover and possibly total obscurment; if someone tries to shoot them, Go to Ground immediately- remember, you only need the Venomthropes alive long enough to get you to the enemy.

-Your Tervigons don't need both psychic powers. Given the list, I would recommend Catalyst, since your Tyrannofexes give you lots of long-range shooting to make Onslaught unnecessary. Another option would be to drop both powers and take Regeneration instead.

-Your Warriors look good, but you might want to consider running them with Devourers in place of Talons- what this does is give you a strong way to harry infantry and lets you attach the Prime to them for protection from S8/9 shots and for +1BS, making their guns much more accurate. A unit like this is impossibly tough for most opponents to crack without using heavy weapons, and they need those for hurting your MCs.

With dropping the two extra Termagants, this leaves us with 40pts free, and we need 55 to get another Venomthrope. The only option I really see is dropping the Barbed Strangler and Toxin Sacs (or Regen, depending on whether you're more concerned with killy or surviving) from the HQ, leaving us with enough for a Venomthrope and restoring one of the Termagants. As much as I'd like to keep the large blast and wound differentiation, I think adding the second Venomthrope is a better idea.

Another option, as mentioned, would be to run a Tyrant as the center of the swarm. This fits better with how I prefer to do things and lets all your MCs potentially reroll misses in combat, but is rather pricey (running 300+pts) and thus can be tough to squeeze in with all the other things in this list. If you wanted to try for this, I would drop the Alpha and the Warrior squad- as much as I like them, they serve the same role (anti-Marine) in the list and give us a lot of points to play with. You should be able to fit a Tyrant with either Heavy Venom Cannon or two sets of Devourers (as you prefer), Old Adversary, and two Tyrant Guard in by dropping your Alpha, the Warrior squad, and keeping to only one Venomthrope; you could also drop the Venomthrope for a third Tyrant Guard to make a real monster of a unit.

Be sure to tell us how you do at the tournament, we're always happy to hear battle reports, and make sure you get some practice with the list before you play. Nothing is more dangerous than playing a list you don't really have experience with.

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