3++ is the new black. | Kirb your enthusiasm!: CENTURION

Thursday, February 24, 2011

CENTURION - full disclosure

Posted by fester

In order to try and get a level of full disclosure (and some feedback), the following are the score sheets for Cent

The overall paint score is TO Paint + Peer Paint Total (total 40).
The overall sports score is Peer Score Total (total 40).
The overall Battle Score is:
Total KP % x 10 + Total Obj% x 10 + Total Quarters% x 10 + VP% x 10 (total 40)
So say you score 5 Obj, 3 obj, 2 obj, 4 obj, 5 obj across your games, the % is 5+3+2+4+5 = 19 of a possible 25 = 76%, so 7.6 towards the total battle.

Peer Paint (Choose 1) Out of 5 per round
>50% unpainted models (0)
Some unpainted models (1)
Models painted (3 colour), but not based (2)
Models painted (3 colour) and based (3)
Models painted very well and based (4)
Models painted so well I may have to steal them at the ~~end of the tournament~~ next available opportunity (5)

TO Paint Sheet (tickbox) Out of 15
1. Less than half of the models painted - 0
2. More than half models painted – +3
3. All models painted & based– +3
4. Drybrushed, Highlighted, Inked, Shaded – +3
5. Squad Markings – +3
6. Bonus TO “awesome marks” - +3

Peer Sports (tickbox) Out of 8 per round
1. Did your opponent have an army list to show you and the appropriate codex for their army?
2. Measurements and dice rolls are all made clearly and accurately (no rubber rulers or intentionally hidden rolls). Your opponent also used only provided dice.
3. Game was played in a polite and respectful manner (game/army questions were answered, not every move or army rule made by an opponent was questioned etc).
4. Game was played in a brisk and orderly fashion. The game was kept moving with good time for the armies in question.
5. Your opponent remained positive if they were losing, and/or were not belittling if they were winning. Your opponent either won or lost in good grace.
6. Any discussion or disagreements were sorted out in a respectful, considerate manner. Please note, asking a referee’s opinion is perfectly acceptable.
7. You had a great game and thoroughly enjoyed yourself.
8. You would actively search out and want to play this person again if you bumped into them at your local FLGS.

Thoughts from those competing / not competing?

Comments (32)

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0 Vote up Vote down

Comrade · 736 weeks ago

Yeah. Works. Sounds just like every other tourny I've been too, though the painting scores generous (thanks) compared to GW's standard affair.

2 replies · active 736 weeks ago

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SageoftheTimes 77p · 736 weeks ago

Depends, though, what do painting scores effect?

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fester40k 73p · 736 weeks ago

Painting affects the Best Overall score (Renaissance Man)

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Kirby 118p · 736 weeks ago

disclosure = good.

As I said before I think you'll find it hard to separate the top painted armies though. Not an issue if you're going to be super harsh but as long as you're consistent. I think it'll come down to how many people think your army is a 5 and how harsh the judges are with their bonus points. Even a dodgy army but has been shaded, inked, highlighted, etc. can otherwise get 12/15.

Does that make sense ? lol

1 reply · active 736 weeks ago

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fester40k 73p · 736 weeks ago

Yup. That's the Judge scheme. If its a dodgy army thats been painted to the point its all been washed/shaded/etc then they deserve a relatively good TO paint. If its dodgy, then peer will give them 3/5 across the board.

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eathos · 736 weeks ago

like I said over on your blog something more than tick and flick is needed for sports.

15 replies · active 736 weeks ago

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Comrade · 736 weeks ago

I've yet to go into a tourny' where any Sportsmenship score that is slower then the maximum amount goes unquestioned by the Judge.

That being said, the scale is always nice to have, give that your opponent can be not a dick, half a dick or one whole dick. The tick/flick system discounts half a dick almost.

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Comrade · 736 weeks ago

*lower, not slower. Just herped so hard I crapped my derp.

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eathos · 736 weeks ago

I just can't let go that giving points away for just showing up with your rule books. and Cent is moving away from the comp tournaments we are trying to move away from (at this point I need to disclose I do badly with my sports scores at tournaments, I put it down to my opponent facing down 20 lance weapons, nothing to do with me being a jerk). sports like comp is subjective, and needs to be removed from competitive tournament play. I just see tournaments where 80-90% of people are scoring full sports and just don't see the point of it. I hate to put something down without presenting a solution but I don't have enough time at work to squeeze it in, so I'll just say, just remove people who are jerks. (be mind full I know this doesn't work as by the time you have removed someone for being a jerk the damage has been done and someone has been made to feel like shit and more than likely won't come back to your event, so some way of pre-emptive stopping of jerkiness needs to happen, but points for showing up with the rule book is not the way to do this)

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fester40k 73p · 736 weeks ago

eathos eathos eathos *shakes head*
The unbeaten player is largely unaffected by Sports, as is 2nd and 3rd.
Only the Best Overall, which is normal Comp Tourney 1st, is affected.

I can see that giving points away for showing up with your shit together is "silly". How about making it 2 points for "list submitted on time" hmm?
In all honestly, I think its poor sportsmanship to turn up to an event with a handwritten list, no core rulebook etc.
Tickbox sports is much easier to use as a player than "rate your opponent out of 5".

I want to keep sports in for this event as its definitely part of "best overall" at a tournament.

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eathos · 736 weeks ago

Reread what I put and should reword a little better, not get right of sports, but remove subjectiveness part of it (well kinda as by nature its subjective).

take Cent it will form part of the awarding of 2 placing's best sportsmen and best overall. and I think you'll find based under the tick and flick method presented most people will get full marks (as can be seen in most tournament results I've looked at). And I feel that is a complete waste of time. best sportsman is something that does need a placing same with best overall and its ranking needs to come from the players. how is the million dollar question. Maybe a vote for your top 2 games of the weekend at the end of the last game. or rank all your games in order of enjoyment for the weekend. As one players best game is different from the next persons, some prefer a hard game some prefer a close game, some prefer the fun game.

Anther random idea would be vastly different tick and flick section, make some of the options mutually exclusive unless you've had the game of your life. take into account different reasons people would enjoy a game of 40k and tick away (eg had a fun game, had a close game, had a hard game)

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Kirby 118p · 736 weeks ago

I like ranking games out of enjoyment but the problem with that becomes this. Say I have 5 games, 3 games were an absolute blast and if I could I'd nominate each of my opponent's for best sports. The other 2 games were shit, not because the opposing player was a dick or anything but it was just pushing plastic pieces around on the board. We all know what I mean here. I'm then forced to rank those really good 3 games as 1,2,3 and the two bad ones as 4,5 when there is a huge gap between 3 and 4.

I love the idea I just think it falls through in implementation. Perhaps combining it with some sort of tick box method? Or a tick box method plus simply rating your game out of 5 on pure enjoyment or something.

I get what eathos is saying in terms of separating best overall from best sports but it is important to distinguish that sports/painting doesn't actually impact upon the 'winner.'

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fester40k 73p · 736 weeks ago

I see your point eath, but consider this:
Would'nt it be better if everyone got max Sport Scores becuase - shock and awe - they deserve it?

I agree on the peer-voting system, but I don't really want to implement that this time. I have too much other shit going on to add that kind of sports and paint judging... Though it would be nice to have a chance to do army display, which I might have to add to the schedule.

Time on the Sunday is a bit short, unfortunately, as people have flights to catch @ 5.00pm

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Kirby 118p · 736 weeks ago

Move from rocky. Problem solved =D.

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eathos · 736 weeks ago

just getting ideas out of my head while I juggle support calls.

I really don't think my ideas are the answer, i just hate putting something down without saying why and/or an idea to help it along.

I've said it before, but points for showing up with the rulebook is dumb.

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fester40k 73p · 736 weeks ago

OK, ill edit it to include the latest FAQ for their codex?

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Cyklown 51p · 736 weeks ago

Nah. It's one point for playing. It sets the baseline. You want this, because it keeps the strength of the weighting but makes average a bit higher, and verbalizes the standards we (mostly) all keep.

Plus... now you have an effect on that one guy who didn't bring his book.

Think about it: painting scores work the same way. You get points for basing, points for actually doing it at all, and then earn more for doing a decent and upwards job.

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fester40k 73p · 736 weeks ago

*thumbsdown*

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Kirby 118p · 736 weeks ago

squared

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fester40k 73p · 736 weeks ago

:( Cheater.

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Kirby 118p · 736 weeks ago

Don't make me mod you to -100 (can I do that? *tries*)!

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Rogue_Pilot_40k 28p · 736 weeks ago

I have no chance of winning any of the prizes anyway lol so i think it is fine :)

2 replies · active 736 weeks ago

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Kirby 118p · 736 weeks ago

The more you lose the more you win according the fester. I've decided to tank it.

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Rogue_Pilot_40k 28p · 736 weeks ago

Hmm fester claims that ;P

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VT2 79p · 736 weeks ago

Two primary things.
Wasn't this supposed to be non-comp?
Why are you giving points for people turning up with all their gear? If they don't have all their gear with them, they likely can't even play, either. Silly.

Peer sport is terrible, and needs to go die in a fire.

3 replies · active 736 weeks ago

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Kirby 118p · 736 weeks ago

There is no comp.

Go read the NOVA booklet ^^.

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fester40k 73p · 736 weeks ago

What he said, no comp, but for the "overall" winner, its equal comp/sports/paint
I need 8 questions to make it 40 pts (8x5 = 40)

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Cyklown 51p · 736 weeks ago

They have the actual competitive side of things, and then there's the extra events where fluffy bunnies can compete too.

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Evil-Termite · 736 weeks ago

Watch out for this one, "7. You had a great game and thoroughly enjoyed yourself." If my opponent tables me, I would have to say , "no" to that one. However, that does not mean that my opponent was a bad sport. It isn't my opponents fault if I reserve my entire list, and then as 2 units at a time come on he just blows them all away. At a tournament he is supposed to capitalize on my bad decisions! As long as he is polite about it, he shouldn't be penalized for me having a bad game.

2 replies · active 736 weeks ago

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fester40k 73p · 736 weeks ago

I have been tabled and still enjoyed it - depends on the perspective.
Saying that, a true sportsman will make it enjoyable to be tabled.

"Come on, you can kill my rhino *boom* yay! ahahaha." etc.
Hell, I have even allowed players to reroll things that wont effect the overall just to make cool stuff happen :)

Saying the above, I think only once have I scored under full comp in a tourney. I'm that kinda guy.